Do they have to close the loops

[sunnyside]

When someone does the time travel thing in Trek does the loop have to be closed.

By which I mean does Admiral Janeway have to reprise her role as psycho from the future once she gets older, and so on in order to have that timesteam "hold".

We see lots of cases where the "loop" doesn't close, but I think those are all in timestreams that eventually don't exist.

[Sionnach Glic]

No idea. And I don't think there's ever been any evidence one way or another.

I, personaly, like to see time-travel as stepping into a parallel, but identical, universe. That would explain how they're able to screw around with the timeline with virtualy no consequences. That would also negate the need for 'closing a loop'.

[Jim]

No idea. And I don't think there's ever been any evidence one way or another.

I, personaly, like to see time-travel as stepping into a parallel, but identical, universe. That would explain how they're able to screw around with the timeline with virtualy no consequences. That would also negate the need for 'closing a loop'.

Yeah. I do not like the "Back to the Future" idea of time travel where there is onlt one timeline and what you do int the past will effect you (people vanishing from pictures etc etc etc).

You could also argue that if you are in the past now, you were ALREADY in the past before you left. Therefore anything you do one you time travel was already done and already effected you old present.

If you like simgle time line, it would be useless to go back in time to try to change things, because in your original past, it would already have been changed.

[Captain Picard's Hair]

If time were a loop, then you might expect Old Janeway to remember getting a visit from her older self when she was younger and to remember what young Captain Janeway did in "Endgame," and none of what happened in the "other" future would have ever happened. Clearly we must invoke some multiple-universe theory to explain this. On the other hand, we've seen cases where a temporal event DOES "reset" the universe as one would expect.

[mwhittington]

Ouch, my head hurts! Is it normal for your ears to spurt blood? This is why I think time travel will never happen and is utterly impossible, for if it were possible, wouldn't we have tourists from the future coming to visit the past?

[Blackstar the Chakat]

Ouch, my head hurts! Is it normal for your ears to spurt blood? This is why I think time travel will never happen and is utterly impossible, for if it were possible, wouldn't we have tourists from the future coming to visit the past?

Becase no one would want visit a past filled with war, racism, terrorism, poverty, and the New York Yankees. Except maybe a New Yorker. I think Time Travel is possible, but you can only change minor details.

[Sionnach Glic]

If time travel was possible, what could possibly prevent you from changing major details?

[sunnyside]

Yeah to some degree I think the only thing that has really handled time travel well was Austin Powers

Basil: I suggest you don't worry about those things and just enjoy yourself.
[to camera]
Basil: That goes for you all, too.

Still they at least expect things to change. For example when Kim was trying to fix his goof that killed the ship he knew had hadn't succeded on his first attempt because he was still there. Of course he might not have known everything about time travel.

Also weren't the borg trying to send a message in "First Contact" if they didn't have to close a loop then just taking out Cochran would have been enough. Though I don't remember that so well.

There does seem to be some kind of lag though. Or something.

Yeah it just doesn't make sense.

[Captain Picard's Hair]

Ouch, my head hurts! Is it normal for your ears to spurt blood? This is why I think time travel will never happen and is utterly impossible, for if it were possible, wouldn't we have tourists from the future coming to visit the past?

Becase no one would want visit a past filled with war, racism, terrorism, poverty, and the New York Yankees. Except maybe a New Yorker. I think Time Travel is possible, but you can only change minor details.

Um, aren't you forgetting an entire half of New York that wants the Yankees to die more than anyone (save perhaps a Red Sox fan)? As a New York Mets fan, this insults me.

[Captain Picard's Hair]

Either multiple histories must exist in one universe, or there are multiple universes. If this occurs in one universe, than it must host both the "old" and "new" histories, since the person who went back and changed history was a product of the old timeline. Clearly, this is crazy.

Another version of the "Grandfather paradox" would go like this:

You go back to kill your grandfather, but in the process you create a new universe and actually travel to the "past" of that universe (which is actually the present of the new universe since your past hasn't happened in this universe yet). In this universe, you kill your grandfather, and your father and yourself aren't born in the new universe. YOU still exist, however, because you were born - in another universe, the original universe. IN the original universe, nobody kills your grandfather, who does go on to father your father who then fathers you. At the moment you go back in time, you disappear from this universe permanently. Presumably you are declared missing and eventually presumed to be dead by the authorities in the original universe, while you continue to live on in the new universe, displaced in time from your point of view.

Basically, the two timelines exist independently of each other, each in it's own universe.

[Blackstar the Chakat]

Ouch, my head hurts! Is it normal for your ears to spurt blood? This is why I think time travel will never happen and is utterly impossible, for if it were possible, wouldn't we have tourists from the future coming to visit the past?

Becase no one would want visit a past filled with war, racism, terrorism, poverty, and the New York Yankees. Except maybe a New Yorker. I think Time Travel is possible, but you can only change minor details.

Um, aren't you forgetting an entire half of New York that wants the Yankees to die more than anyone (save perhaps a Red Sox fan)? As a New York Mets fan, this insults me.

Sorry about insulting you. Uh...who are the Mets though?

If time travel was possible, what could possibly prevent you from changing major details?

I'm not sure how to describe it. Time isn't really a strait line. From the outside it's more of a wiggily wobbly sort of mass. I guess in a word, fate. You might be able to stop Hitler from starting World War II, but that means the Soviets might start it at another time. Different details, same result. You might stop someone from getting shot, but they die from something else. You see, things can't get any better, can't be any worse, because that's the way things are.

[Sionnach Glic]

Ah, well, I don't believe in fate.

[Captain Picard's Hair]

Sorry about insulting you. Uh...who are the Mets though?

You must not be a baseball fan. We're not too popular with much of America, either - partly for no other reason than the fact the Mets are a NY team, and partly because we can virtually print money (though NOBODYs revenues come remotely close to the Yankees').

[Blackstar the Chakat]

Sorry about insulting you. Uh...who are the Mets though?

You must not be a baseball fan. We're not too popular with much of America, either - partly for no other reason than the fact the Mets are a NY team, and partly because we can virtually print money (though NOBODYs revenues come remotely close to the Yankees').

So much money still can't ensure victory. The brewers almost made it the the playoffs last year and they're pretty low budget as far as good teams go.

[Captain Picard's Hair]

Milwaukee's farm has been massively productive - so has ours, though it's too bad Kazmir and Milledge will be playing for other teams. Obviously, you can't buy competent management/ownership.