Bush visits Iraq.

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Sionnach Glic
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Bush visits Iraq.

Post by Sionnach Glic »

Bush holds 'war council' in Iraq
US President George W Bush has met senior US and Iraqi officials at a US air base in Anbar province in Iraq.

The talks at al-Asad air base were attended by the US secretary of state, defence secretary, the US ambassador to Iraq and the head of US forces there.

They were joined by Iraq's PM Nouri Maliki and other senior Iraqis.

Mr Bush is facing pressure at home for a US withdrawal, but he insisted any pull out will only result from a "calm assessment" by leaders on the ground.

"Those decisions will be based on a calm assessment by our military commanders on the conditions on the ground, not a nervous reaction by Washington politicians to poll results in the media," said Mr Bush, addressing troops at the base on the US Labor Day holiday.

"In other words when we begin to draw down troops from Iraq it will be from a position of strength and success, not from a position of fear and failure."

White House 'anger'

Speaking to reporters earlier, Mr Bush said his top officials had advised him that if current successes continue, security levels could be maintained with fewer troops.

However, he made no specific reference to how much troop numbers could be cut or any possible timetable for withdrawal, adding: "America does not abandon its friends. America will not abandon the Iraqi people".

The BBC's Matt Frei in Washington says the comment could have been a reference to UK forces who on the same day that Mr Bush was visiting Anbar withdrew their last troops from inside the southern city of Basra.

A total of 5,550 UK troops are now located at the airport outside Basra and their Basra Palace base is under Iraqi control.

Although the Bush administration has not publicly criticised the British, our correspondent says that in private officials are annoyed and say the move is not good for a White House which feels increasingly isolated.

The meeting in Anbar, which a Pentagon official called a "war council", comes just days before a key report on how Mr Bush's surge strategy is faring.

On 10 and 11 September, the head of US forces in Iraq, General David Petraeus, and the US ambassador, Ryan Crocker, are due to report to Congress on the situation in Iraq, focusing particularly on the effect of the surge, which reached full levels in June.

Secrecy

The president was accompanied on his visit by Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice and the US national security adviser, Steven Hadley.

US Defence Secretary Robert Gates arrived ahead of Mr Bush for talks with senior US officials including Gen Petraeus and Mr Crocker.

"This is the last big gathering of the president's military advisers and the Iraqi leadership before the president decides on the way forward," Pentagon spokesman Geoff Morrell said.

"This is very much a decisional meeting. This meeting will put him much closer to a decision if he hasn't made one yet."

In an extraordinary move, Iraq's senior leaders, including Prime Minister Maliki and President Jalal Talabani, travelled to Anbar to meet Mr Bush.

For Mr Maliki, a Shia, it was only his third visit to the Sunni-dominated province.

The last time Mr Bush was in Iraq was more than a year ago. Now, as then, the surprise trip was shrouded in secrecy because of the ongoing instability.

He stopped unannounced on board Air Force One en route to a summit of Asia-Pacific leaders in Australia and remained on the heavily protected air base for the duration of his visit. He has now left Iraq and is headed to Sydney.

The BBC's Hugh Sykes, in Baghdad, says Mr Bush's decision to land in Anbar province is significant. Anbar, west of Baghdad, has often been referred to as the centre of the Sunni insurgency, but the US now believes it has greatly reduced the threat from Sunni Arab militant groups, such as al-Qaeda in Iraq, our correspondent says.

Several imams have been killed for supporting US-led forces and preaching against al-Qaeda in Iraq at Friday prayers, and many local tribes have turned against the insurgents, he adds.
Source

Also;
Our country's authoritarians are glorifying the Leader today like it's 2003, all for his very brave (and covert) sneaking into Iraq. Jules Crittenden (cousin of David Frum) uses language typically reserved for Jesus to describe Bush's every movement:

NPR reporting he's landed, enroute to an econmic summit in Australia. Web reports now coming in.

AP: He's in Anbar, landed at Al-Asad. . . . he's expected to meet with al-Maliki and Sunni tribal leaders who've joined the United States and the Iraqi government against al-Qaeda.

He is risen. This is the same Jules Crittenden who, back in January on the day of the President's speech unveiling the Surge, began his post this way: "George Bush will address us tonight, and show us the way forward." He will show us the way forward.

Similarly, Blue Texan notes that Glenn Reynolds -- in addition to linking to the Crittenden post above -- also linked to a post which began this way: "Unlike the last Commander-in-chief, is there any doubt that the men and women who serve our country love President Bush." Finally, Fred Kagan, writing in National Review, declared that Bush's trip "should be recognized as at least the Gettysburg of this war" -- at least -- and that the Leader's Glorious Visit "could well mark a key turning point in the war in Iraq and the war on terror."

He is Jesus. He is Lincoln. He is beloved by Our Troops. He "shows us the way forward." He is Our Leader.
Hmm, wasn't Gettysburg the battle in which General Lee refused to admit he was losing in the face of clear evidence and wasted thousands of lives in a pointless charge?
Oh, the bloody irony...
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Post by Mikey »

HA! Good point! The article you quoted doesn't mention which side of that analagous Gettysburg we're on...

The only ting about George W. Bush that I wish was like Jesus is that if I were lucky, nobody would know where he was in three days.
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Post by DSG2k »

The surge worked and is working.

Leftist Senator Harry Reid pointed out Anbar frequently a few months ago, circa the time of his "the war is lost" quote. Assorted American media gleefully reported that the province was beyond our ability to handle politically or militarily.

Note the text of the quoted article . . . Bush landed in Anbar. It's now a very safe place. It's safe because we're there in force, and the tribal leaders know we're there securing it. Allying with the Americans and the Iraqi government seems less of a gamble.

Of course some want it to be a gamble, and a losing one at that. They want the United States to fail, because success risks validation of the President and his supporters. That is one thing which must not be allowed, in their minds, and they themselves have noted this explicitly.

At best, this philosophy is misguided, and proof that hatred of Bush has blinded leftists to the collateral damage of their hate when it comes to the US as a whole.

At worst, it is US citizens and lawmakers acting directly against US lives and US interests, in the knowledge of what is being done.

There's a word for that. (Well, actually there are several, but only a handful can be said in mixed company.)
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Post by Mikey »

I'm sorry, but I think you're missing the point. I've lived in the US my whole life, and I've never heard anyobody say that the US military was not powerful enough to subdue the militants in Iraq, given enough funding and time. The question is, how much do we have to spend - in funding, time, and most importantly American casualties - in order to ensure the safety of a province (to use your example) which has NOTHING TO DO WITH US?

In other words, what effect does the day-to-day safety of Anbar province have on American life? Not one great enough to justify expending American soldiers' lives on it, I'm sure.
At best, this philosophy is misguided, and proof that hatred of Bush has blinded leftists to the collateral damage of their hate when it comes to the US as a whole.

At worst, it is US citizens and lawmakers acting directly against US lives and US interests, in the knowledge of what is being done.
By ignoring this question, and thusly ignoring the safety and lives of Americans, it is the right-wingers who are "blinded" by their refusal to either admit an earlier wrong decision or to change their minds when reason dictates it.
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Post by Mikey »

Sorry to double-post, but one other thing has just registered:
At best, this philosophy is misguided, and proof that hatred of Bush has blinded leftists to the collateral damage of their hate when it comes to the US as a whole.

At worst, it is US citizens and lawmakers acting directly against US lives and US interests, in the knowledge of what is being done.
Are you saying that dissension with the administration, and expecting the government to accede to the will of the people, is "collateral damage?" Other people have subscribed the that philosophy -

Senator McCarthy
Pol Pot
Fidel Castro
Josef Stalin
Adolf Hitler
...
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Post by Aaron »

DSG2k wrote:The surge worked and is working.

Leftist Senator Harry Reid pointed out Anbar frequently a few months ago, circa the time of his "the war is lost" quote. Assorted American media gleefully reported that the province was beyond our ability to handle politically or militarily.

Note the text of the quoted article . . . Bush landed in Anbar. It's now a very safe place. It's safe because we're there in force, and the tribal leaders know we're there securing it. Allying with the Americans and the Iraqi government seems less of a gamble.

Of course some want it to be a gamble, and a losing one at that. They want the United States to fail, because success risks validation of the President and his supporters. That is one thing which must not be allowed, in their minds, and they themselves have noted this explicitly.

At best, this philosophy is misguided, and proof that hatred of Bush has blinded leftists to the collateral damage of their hate when it comes to the US as a whole.

At worst, it is US citizens and lawmakers acting directly against US lives and US interests, in the knowledge of what is being done.

There's a word for that. (Well, actually there are several, but only a handful can be said in mixed company.)
Yeah and I've got waterfront property in Arizona to sell you. The insurgents couldn't just be laying low in the Baghdad area while this is going on and shifting their attacks to outlying areas. Ultimately they will win because despite Cuckoo Mcmonkey Pants delusions the US doesn't have the stomach nor the manpower for a prolonged engagement in Iraq of the type required to subdue the insurgency. They just have to outlast you.

*Edit: And if these zones are so safe then why do the visitors go about in massively armed convoys wearing body armour with gunship escort? Did Bush even leave the bloody base?
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Post by Mikey »

As my Canuck neighbor pointed out,
the US doesn't have the stomach nor the manpower for a prolonged engagement in Iraq of the type required to subdue the insurgency. They just have to outlast you.
Well... manpower COULD be provided, and maybe "stomach" was a slightly wrong choice of word, but his intention is correct. While I was not alive at the time of the inception, I do remember that at one time we (the U.S.) decided it was our job to bail the French out during a small uprising against them in a town called Dien Bien Phu. What we ended up with was a "police action" in a country where the populace was against us, where the terrain and the necessary types of warfare were unfamiliar and disadvantageous to us, and ultimately in a situation which our own president (LBJ) said in supposed confidence that we couldn't win!

BTW - when I was in high school in the late eighties, I mentioned the similarities between that situation and the then-current U.S. involvement in Central America during a session with Republican New Jersey Congressman Jim Courter. I described the situation as above, but never actually mentioned the word "Viet Nam." Our esteemed Congressman replied to me, "Obviously you're talking about Grenada."

I had to be escorted out of the conference.
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Post by Aaron »

I'm afraid manpower is basically at it's limit. The Army and Marines are already scraping the bottom of the barrell to come up with enough troops to complete the surge and meet their other commitments. The NG are also heavily committed. The Army had to institute a twelve month rest period between tours for every soldier because of burn out, that stretches the manpower requirements out even further. As it is the only people not feeling the pinch are the Navy and the Air Force and there's already been re-roling of people from those two services to the Army to pull convoy duty. That's how bad things are.
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Post by Mikey »

You are correct, of course, Mr. Kendall. What I didn't iterate clearly enough was that by "COULD" I mean that our situation had gotten to the point that our former cocaine-using CIC was considering instituting the draft. I repeat: THE DRAFT!!!
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Post by Aaron »

Mikey wrote:You are correct, of course, Mr. Kendall. What I didn't iterate clearly enough was that by "COULD" I mean that our situation had gotten to the point that our former cocaine-using CIC was considering instituting the draft. I repeat: THE DRAFT!!!
Yeah, I wouldn't concern yourself with that. A draft bill gets introduced every year and every year it gets shot down. The military does not want a draft and only the most delusional in the government want it either. It would be a disaster from a professional standpoint for the US Military anyways.
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Post by Sionnach Glic »

Hasn't training time for new recruits in the US dropped by a few weeks? This would suggest to me that they are indeed running out of troops, and time to train new ones.

Also, I seriously doubt any non-military personell were let anywhere near the base while Shrub was there. And I have serious doubts he ever left the facility.
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Post by Aaron »

Rochey wrote:Hasn't training time for new recruits in the US dropped by a few weeks? This would suggest to me that they are indeed running out of troops, and time to train new ones.
I'm not up on the latest recruit training length by the US but I do know that they lowered recruit standards to previously unheard of levels to make up for their recruiting shortfall and that their still having trouble meeting their quota's. There's even been story's of less than scrupulous recruiters targeting the borderline "mentally challenged" in order to get their required men.
Also, I seriously doubt any non-military personell were let anywhere near the base while Shrub was there. And I have serious doubts he ever left the facility.
If this visit follows the example of the previous US officials visits the entire area was probably "sanitized". I feel sorry for the troops because of the extra work that would have been foisted on them due to this visit. When I was in there where few things as irritating as a "dog and pony show".
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Post by Sionnach Glic »

I'll have to dig it up again, but I'm almost positive I heard a few months ago that they had lowered training time by a couple of weeks.
There's even been story's of less than scrupulous recruiters targeting the borderline "mentally challenged" in order to get their required men.
I can think of no words to express my feelings if this is true.
I feel sorry for the troops because of the extra work that would have been foisted on them due to this visit. When I was in there where few things as irritating as a "dog and pony show".
You were in Iraq?

And I can imagine the troops wouldn't be too happy about it, they probably pulled dozens of troops off other duties just to watch over the idiot who got them stuck there in the first place.
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Post by Aaron »

Rochey wrote:I'll have to dig it up again, but I'm almost positive I heard a few months ago that they had lowered training time by a couple of weeks.
I'd be interested in reading that if you can find it.

I can think of no words to express my feelings if this is true.
To be fair all of the cases were caught and the men discharged before reaching their units but it doesn't speak well of the recruiting system. You should never trust a recruiter just on general principle, their kind of like a used car salesmen but this is low even for them.
You were in Iraq?
Oh hell no, I'm Canadian. I served in several domestic disaster zones though and had to take time out from work to do stupid crap because the Prime Minister was coming around. Not to mention the inumerable visits from various Defence Ministers and General Officers that seemed to require us to put on a show rather than just have them view us in the course of our normal duties. I once had to put on a display of the new radio system that Canada bought (before it was ready and that didn't work) for a bunch of British Generals that were shopping for their new communications system and wanted to view ours in action. So we had to setup a display and fake a working comms system using half functioning equipment.
And I can imagine the troops wouldn't be too happy about it, they probably pulled dozens of troops off other duties just to watch over the idiot who got them stuck there in the first place.
Yeah, this kind of thing causes all kinds of backups with patrols and maintenance.
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Post by Sionnach Glic »

I'd be interested in reading that if you can find it.
Still, looking (I gave up last night). If I do find it I'll post it here.
To be fair all of the cases were caught and the men discharged before reaching their units but it doesn't speak well of the recruiting system.
Thats something at least.
Oh hell no, I'm Canadian.
Thats why I found it odd, AFAIK Canada hasn't gotten involved, have they?
I served in several domestic disaster zones though and had to take time out from work to do stupid crap because the Prime Minister was coming around. Not to mention the inumerable visits from various Defence Ministers and General Officers that seemed to require us to put on a show rather than just have them view us in the course of our normal duties.
No matter what job you have, if your superior comes around to see you acting normally then you aren't acting normally. :P
I once had to put on a display of the new radio system that Canada bought (before it was ready and that didn't work) for a bunch of British Generals that were shopping for their new communications system and wanted to view ours in action. So we had to setup a display and fake a working comms system using half functioning equipment.
:lol:
I wonder if they ended up buying it...
Yeah, this kind of thing causes all kinds of backups with patrols and maintenance.
I'd say it would put a lot of people in danger as well, if someone important arives the enemy would naturally like to take them out. I'm surpirsed they didn't try anything while Bush was there. Although I doubt anyone could get within a mile radius of that place.
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