I wonder...

[Mikey]

Then won't you end up with a model that performs like a Space Marine, even though it really shouldn't?

[Deepcrush]

No, because in order to match our ST universe a SM would have Str 6 not Str 4 and would still out match everyone else in game but not so much that no one else in game could have a chance of defeating while maintaining the SM's status to uber coolness.

Yes, I said that in one breath.

[Mikey]

Umm... OK.

[Reliant121]

I'm confused....i dont get all this stats stuff

if you can convert 40K stats to fit star trek ground combat then cool. I'm here for the playing the games

[sunnyside]

While I'd admit reducing the granularity would differentiate the races more I kind of like the theoretical compatability. In theory it should make the game balance better, and it certainly makes it easier to assign points.

[Deepcrush]

The problem being that now a klingon is the equal of an Ork and a Jem'hadar is a kroot. Vulcans, humans, romulans and cardassians would all be the IG. That makes no sense for all except the Cardis. The scale fails to fit the need of the in universe measure.

[sunnyside]

Well you just have to quit making humans into Eldar.

Still though with the Klingons redundent systems I'm willing to let them be in the same order of magnitude as an Ork. At least for playability purposes.

I could see some S4 if it was well supported in cannon.

The trouble is this. We're working to try and make ST playable in a 40K environment. The danger zone you're getting into is making it playable in a not quite 40K environment.

Not that I can't see your point of course. You'd rather have stats all over the board instead of 3's with the rare 4 or 2. Though actually having similar stats would make it a bit easier on the newbs.

Mikey. I'd say wait for 5th. Though maybe someone would give you their old 4th book if you're in the community. I may be very late in adapting. But did you notice the vassal thing? That is for playing people online much like we're proposing here. Except the dice rolling and everything is all integrated. So with a 5th ed book and a codex for the race you want to play you could use that to play your heart out.

1000 points is probably too big if I'm supposed to do everything. If two of you are moving the pices and posting the picutres it's fine and lets you get more of a "battle" feel to things.

[Mikey]

I just thought that a 1,000-point army (unless you're talking about SM with vehicles, daemonhunters, or something like that) could end up being pretty big for a newb (like myself) to manage. I'm certainly game for trying, though...

And yeah, I didn't log on to VASSAL yet, but to do something like that I'd expect I'd need AT LEAST the codex for the army of my choice. Are they for sale as e-books or PDF's?

On that note, any advice on how to choose an army?

[Deepcrush]

Pick the one that sounds the coolest to you. Find an army that you'll have fun playing with. They are mostly balanced so odds are about the same with all of them. Some armies do well against some but not others. Its all in the fun. Read about them on the Games Workshop website and wiki. That should give you a good basic idea of what each army can do.

[Mikey]

Thanks. My twisted side tells me to try Dark Eldar, but rumor has it that they'll be gone when 5th ed. comes out.

[sunnyside]

I don't think they have e-books. But I googled Dark Eldar codex ebook to make sure. I got a bunch of rapidshare and torrent sites so I think that pretty well spells out the situation.

That actually makes sense. The game is intended to be played in real life on a table, so you'd need a physical book. Though i guess more people have really portable laptops.

Anyway I'm 99% percent sure Dark Eldar are in because of the rumors coming out for the codex and new models they're supposed to get sometime next year. So far it sounds like they aren't fundamentally changing them or dropping models. DE really have been overdue for a new dex. They actually have an official update to their current one that you have to download and print. Hopefully all of that is in there.

Anyway to a degree you also want to have your army match your playstyle. DE are a thinking mans army. I believe the codex says a connoisseurs army. The reason being that while potent, crazy fast, and loaded up with special rules the models are fragile. You can give any 13 year old a space marine army and they'll have a good time as they may lose but they'll get some kills and like as not manage to still have some models at the end of the game. The same kid with DE might have pretty well lost before they even get their first turn as the enemies first volly tears their transports apart and their warriors die in the wreckage.

This still applies even at the highest tournament level. DE make up a small percentage of the armies present. But unlike some of the races that are perennial losers periodically a DE general will come along and absolutely rip everyone else to shreds and take top honors.

[Deepcrush]

Tau are a combined arms army based around ranged fire. The weakest Tau weapon is str 5. They are based around whole unit death. If I pick a squad, it will be dead at the end of this turn. I have so many weapons that ignore armor that I can wipe out whole armies of grey knights in 2 or 3 turns. Its rare for an enemy tank to live to turn 2 when I play.

There is no army in the game that can match the Tau in a shooting match. Then again, there isn't an army in the game that can't beat the Tau in close combat.

[sunnyside]

I play craftworld Eldar. They actually have a versatility of models for different playstyles but the cornerstones of Eldar are specialization, special rules, and movement.

By specialization I mean that in most other armies when you have a squad of guys their will be a couple with special weapons, and maybe a seargent with some other special equipment they can have. Like the guard forces you played where you had a squad of guys with a heavy long range weapon, a shorter plasma weapon, and if they wanted you could have taken a sargent with special gear.

Eldar however field units where all the guys do something funky. Like every single model is armed with a meltagun instead of 1 or 2. Or maybe the entire unit has power swords. Or every model has a high power long range weapon. In order to have the game go well each unit has to be doing what they're good at while the enemy tries to force them to do what they aren't good at. Consequently the army needs to work together, and the different units really need to complement each other.

Special rules are just their thing. Lots of armies you can explain their guys with the reference sheet. Here are their stats, and there is the weapon they have. Pretty much all you need to know. Eldar units typically have a bunch of funky stuff.

Finally motion. And that's what I like about them. Some armies are static. Tau often make a firing line and those fire warriors would really like it if they never had to move the whole game. Other armies are straightforward. A "swamp them" Ork army will move forward toward you every turn. Eldar however are all over the place. Moving forward back. Lots of stuff going on, and games against the same opponent on the same map can play out very differently. This can be extremely rewarding and let you stomp other forces, but it carries the risk that if you fail to make the right moves you can get crushed really fast. Generally expereinced Eldar players will caution new players to view their first games as "learning experiences".

[Mikey]

That's the impression I got with both Eldar and DE. By specializations, are you referring mostly to Aspect Warriors?

I thought based on my limited knowledge that Harlequins might be a way around the high degree of specialization, but I imagine Harlequins are terribly expensive to field.

[sunnyside]

That's the impression I got with both Eldar and DE. By specializations, are you referring mostly to Aspect Warriors?

I thought based on my limited knowledge that Harlequins might be a way around the high degree of specialization, but I imagine Harlequins are terribly expensive to field.

The Harlies sound like they're also about to take a nerfing in the form of the nerf to rending. Not sure how that will shake out though. And I'd imagine it'd require a new Tyranid codex in short order.

Specialization is primarily present in the aspect warriros. Though they make up a lot of your possible units. But it carries beyond that. No heavy weapons in the sniper squads. No mixing different types of support weapon. And many units, like war walkers, can have versatility but it isn't advisable.

You do get some though. Guardians for example.