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GrahamKennedy wrote:Interesting Special Effect Methodology

I think this is why we should be grateful for quality CGI...

To a degree. There's something about a real physical model that even the best CGI can't quite capture right.

Tyyr wrote:To a degree. There's something about a real physical model that even the best CGI can't quite capture right.

My general theory is that people should be filmed on physical sets. If you are doing a space battle you can use mostly CGI. I still don't think that even the best tech has gotten to the point it meshes well with people moving about.

Certainly not on a TV production level.

Then again GI Joe's FX were just awful, by any standard.

BigJKU316 wrote:

Tyyr wrote:To a degree. There's something about a real physical model that even the best CGI can't quite capture right.

My general theory is that people should be filmed on physical sets. If you are doing a space battle you can use mostly CGI. I still don't think that even the best tech has gotten to the point it meshes well with people moving about.

100% right. Have the sets as real as possible. Minimise Bluescreen/Actor interaction, because that's crappy.

But for space battles? I think CGI is just better all the way.

SolkaTruesilver wrote:100% right. Have the sets as real as possible. Minimise Bluescreen/Actor interaction, because that's crappy.

That depends on how good the software is and how much money you've got to throw at it. Take the last couple of PotC films, for example - Bill Nighy looks like he's wearing an animatronic prosthetic, but it's all CGI. Likewise King Kong and Gollum - again, CGI, but incredibly realistic. Or at least as realistic as people with squids for heads, 100 foot gorillas and millennia-old hobbits get.

Captain Seafort wrote:

SolkaTruesilver wrote:100% right. Have the sets as real as possible. Minimise Bluescreen/Actor interaction, because that's crappy.

That depends on how good the software is and how much money you've got to throw at it. Take the last couple of PotC films, for example - Bill Nighy looks like he's wearing an animatronic prosthetic, but it's all CGI. Likewise King Kong and Gollum - again, CGI, but incredibly realistic. Or at least as realistic as people with squids for heads, 100 foot gorillas and millennia-old hobbits get.

Yhea. But on the other hand, you have Star Wars, which had little to no set at all, and just a lot of non-real things.

Captain Seafort wrote:

SolkaTruesilver wrote:100% right. Have the sets as real as possible. Minimise Bluescreen/Actor interaction, because that's crappy.

That depends on how good the software is and how much money you've got to throw at it. Take the last couple of PotC films, for example - Bill Nighy looks like he's wearing an animatronic prosthetic, but it's all CGI. Likewise King Kong and Gollum - again, CGI, but incredibly realistic. Or at least as realistic as people with squids for heads, 100 foot gorillas and millennia-old hobbits get.

All about the right tools for the job. Harvey "two face" Dent was another good use of CGI in Dark Knight. Usually, something like that would be done with makeup. However, by using CGI they were able to give the impression that parts of his face had been removed, rather then added too.

Weren't the majority of the armies in the Lord of the Rings movies also computer generated?

kostmayer wrote: All about the right tools for the job. Harvey "two face" Dent was another good use of CGI in Dark Knight. Usually, something like that would be done with makeup. However, by using CGI they were able to give the impression that parts of his face had been removed, rather then added too.

Weren't the majority of the armies in the Lord of the Rings movies also computer generated?

Yes. But what about the close-up shots of the Horsies charging into the Orc lines? Were those generated, or with actors?

The thing is, I prefer to have real sets, with real actors, as much as you can. Add some special effect for the Grandiose, but don't make special effect "mundane" like George Lucas did.

I prefer the 'real' as well. Gimme the special effects of the OT over the PT any day of the week.

Tyyr wrote:To a degree. There's something about a real physical model that even the best CGI can't quite capture right.

I actually agree with you 100%. To be honest only the newest CGI modells from star trek didn't bother me that much and still it didn't look as "real" as the beautiful TMP e-nil model or even the gorgeous E-D model from Generations.

And thank you GK for your insightful post, this was more or less what I was looking for:)

Some shows have even suffered for it. ENT suffered for its CGI dependent flyby shots because they tried to make it too glitsy, too advanced and too shiney. if they had a duller painted grey real model then I'm pretty sure it wouldn't be half as bad (the other half being the actual design).

SolkaTruesilver wrote: Yes. But what about the close-up shots of the Horsies charging into the Orc lines? Were those generated, or with actors?

They were with actors. The "orcs" were standing in a line each a few meters apart and the horses would "charge" through them and then the orcstuntmen dropped spectecularily when they rode past them creating the illusion that they were ridden down. If you looked at the scene from a different angle you could see that the orcs and horsemen never came into contact and that there was quite a bit of space between them - still a dangerous stunt.

Reliant121 wrote:Some shows have even suffered for it. ENT suffered for its CGI dependent flyby shots because they tried to make it too glitsy, too advanced and too shiney. if they had a duller painted grey real model then I'm pretty sure it wouldn't be half as bad (the other half being the actual design).

If Enterprise had it's failure, it wasn't because of the CGI. You are nitpicking elements that, in a properly written and directed serie, would either had been ignored or acclaimed.

Seriously, you can't say that the reason Enterprise was a flop was because of the CGI used for the ship design?

Did I once claim Enterprise was killed entirely due to CGI?

I made a comment about my preference. Enterprise had a whole host of other reasons that I really haven't the time or patience to get into, besides Tyyr has already done it to great effect.