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Oooh, bad example dude.

I don't think so. My belief in G-d is as serious as a heart attack. If you mean people who are willing to die in the process of killing others, then that's a separate discussion; that's using faith as an excuse rather than accepting its teachings.

Hurm I fear I'm late to the party here. But I would like to point something out.


From Gods point of view the afterlife is a very real thing that he has control over.


From such a vantage point, people on earth are sort of like, I dunno, little kids at a birthday party, and "murder" by God would be like a parent taking a kid home early. Sure the other kids might be sad that they aren't with their friend anymore and cry and spaz or whatever like its the end of the world, and the removed child didn't want to go. But as a parent if it's time to go it's time to go, and it isn't even that big a deal to us because the parents know the kids will be having fun soon enough, and will be seeing each other tomorrow at school anyway.

That's an interesting analogy, Sunny, and if that's what you believe, then I'm sure it helps a bit when people you love die. For myself, I "spaz" a bit when my friends and family pass because I'm fairly certain that all of our concepts of an afterlife are wrong.

Mikey wrote:I don't think so. My belief in G-d is as serious as a heart attack. If you mean people who are willing to die in the process of killing others, then that's a separate discussion; that's using faith as an excuse rather than accepting its teachings.

The Light Brigade was slaughtered due to a combination of shite intelligence and moronic officers. Essentially they died because they lacked all the facts, it....just doesn't seem like an analogy that really helps you out.

Mikey wrote:He could. He chose to do as He did. If "ours is not to wonder why" is good enough for the Light Brigade, it's good enough for me. Who am I to judge?

Who are you not to judge?

(Incidentally in the Light Brigade context, "ours not to wonder why" is meant to be a tragic sentiment precisely because it led to a senseless and pointless slaughter.)

sunnyside wrote:Hurm I fear I'm late to the party here. But I would like to point something out.


From Gods point of view the afterlife is a very real thing that he has control over.


From such a vantage point, people on earth are sort of like, I dunno, little kids at a birthday party, and "murder" by God would be like a parent taking a kid home early. Sure the other kids might be sad that they aren't with their friend anymore and cry and spaz or whatever like its the end of the world, and the removed child didn't want to go. But as a parent if it's time to go it's time to go, and it isn't even that big a deal to us because the parents know the kids will be having fun soon enough, and will be seeing each other tomorrow at school anyway.

Wow Sunny, I don't think I've ever seen anybody put it that way before, it somewhat mirrors my own ideas. I also look at it this way, if there really is no God or afterlife and we really do go pfft gone then theist or atheist it really dosen't matter. If on the other hand there is a God and an afterlife it would behoove me to be ready, now wouldn't it. The only way we are going to have proof.....is when we die.

Sorry to join the party late but since basically gods supposed deeds from the old testament are on discussion I would be really interested in who actually thinks that god really was responsible for those incidents (gread flood, murdering of the firstborns etc.) and that those things and the involvment of God are just clumsy explanations of a primitive people not understanding the world they live in?

Now I am not saying I do or do not believe in God since it seems it doesn't really matter in this debate, but how can anyone take anything from the old testament literally? Pretty much anything what happens there can be rather easily explained by historical circumstances with god attached later on to make sense of it, imho.

Well this thread first started off with a discussion of whether killing all the first-born kids in Egypt was a just act, so I think we're sort of working under the assumption that the Bible's claims of God's involvement are correct.

Cpl Kendall wrote:The Light Brigade was slaughtered due to a combination of shite intelligence and moronic officers. Essentially they died because they lacked all the facts, it....just doesn't seem like an analogy that really helps you out.

Yes, I'm familiar with the poem. What I was getting at is that those men who died in the Crimean War were men all of whom made the decision to follow an order, right or wrong, even though it was fairly clear that it would lead to their deaths.

GrahamKennedy wrote:Who are you not to judge?

Are you kidding? I'm the same person to not judge you for your professed atheism, or someone else for being a Christian, or somebody else for being a Buddhist. You can continue to call it a cop-out if you like, though I at least know that this is not the case, but for this discussion we must at least take my belief in the following maxim as a given: "G-d" cannot be judged or even delineated in human terms." Therefore, I have no right to judge His actions anymore than I have the right to judge your belief system. As far as judging you for the morality of your acts, it's a different paradigm - you obviously can be judged in human terms - must be, in fact.

Yeah, I like to follow up the quote "Vengeance is mine, sayeth the Lord" with: "Justice is ours, sayeth me."

Tsukiyumi wrote: "Vengeance is mine, sayeth the Lord"

But he sub-contracts...

Just because I have faith doesn't mean I can't joke about it...

Deepcrush wrote:Just because I have faith doesn't mean I can't joke about it...

Which is a great gift to have.