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Noticed something funny in the manual tonight (page #151). If the ships self destruct sequence is activated, "Matter from the primary deuterium tankage and the total supply of antimatter from the storage pods on Deck 42 are expelled simultaneously, producing an energy release on the order of 1015 megajoules, roughly equivalent to 1,000 photon torpedoes". So then 1015 Megajoules is equal to 1000 photon torpedoes!!! cool beans So for simple math, what would half of that be? I'm thinking that 500 Photon torpedoes would equal 507.5 megajoules. I am wrong though as it turns out, "These are detonated in concert with intentional overloads of all fusion reaction chambers. The release yield of the secondary system is calculated to be 109 megajoules, roughly equivalent to 500 photon torpedoes". Ok? so 500 torps are equal to 109 megajoules... so then 500 torpedoes(109 megajoules) X 2 = 218 megajoules..... damn it!!!


Curse my bad math skills!!!!

So one Mega joule per torpedo.

That's about a half pound of TNT if I remember my conversion.

4.1 gigajoules is a ton of TNT.

So run these numbers and see if they jive?
1 gigajoule = 0.24 tons of TNT
http://convert-to.com/conversion/energy ... to-tn.html
The above gives the following numbers.
Amount : 4.1 gigajoules (GJ)
Equals : 0.98 tons of TNT (tn)

http://www.kylesconverter.com/energy,-w ... ons-of-tnt
gives the following:
500 Megajoules to Tons Of Tnt = 0.1195
1,000 Megajoules to Tons Of Tnt = 0.239

All of which is hilarious if you re-read the description for the NX class
"Enterprise has three 500 GigaJoule "phase cannon"
which means one single cannon fires around 119.5 ton's of TNT's worth of energy
Even the borg of that time might question the tactics of attacking the NX class with weapons like this!

Yeah my math skills have dwindled lately.

That is onscreen dialogue too with Enterprise. And if I remember they overloaded them. Haven't watched the episode lately, but they were rated for lower amount and then ended up creating a decent sized creator on some moon.

DS9 has a dialogue where they can destroy a surface of a planet in a matter of hours. As in completely make the thing molten. TNG and VOY says they can pop asteroids too.

Then again you got Trek V where they launched a torpedo at 'God' and had the e plosive effect of a mortar. They could have dropped the torpedo and it would have done far far more damage. Maybe they went with that.

Also we got real world calculations of what a pure matter and antimatter reaction would be, and it is definitely in the megaton range. Which is billions of Mega joules.

I really think they meant to say Gigajoules (or greater).
On page #143, the manual states the following about handheld phaser power cells, "Energy is stored within a replenishable sarium krellide cell. Sarium krellide holds a maximum of 1.3 × 106 megajoules per cubic centimeter, at a maximum leak rate of no more than 1.05 kilojoules per hour. When one considers that the total stored energy of even the Type I phaser, if released all at once, is enough to vaporize three cubic meters of tritanium, it is reassuring to know that a full storage cell cannot be discharged accidentally".
So 500 Photon torpedoes = 109 megajoules... maybe they should pack the torps with a bunch of Sarium Krellide Cells. KA-Boooooooom!!!!

That's also incorrect usage. Should be kilowatts per hour to begin with. Not sure how you measure energy per square measurement.

While it seems low but total energy discharge for a phased really isn't alot. Seems to have the energy of a very small explosive. Enough to kill people nearby but not enough to do substantial damage.

Also, it is well known not to use the TNG Tech Manual of any kind of measurement reference.

00111010 01000100 wrote: ↑Thu Jul 02, 2020 1:22 amNoticed something funny in the manual tonight (page #151). If the ships self destruct sequence is activated, "Matter from the primary deuterium tankage and the total supply of antimatter from the storage pods on Deck 42 are expelled simultaneously, producing an energy release on the order of 1015 megajoules, roughly equivalent to 1,000 photon torpedoes". So then 1015 Megajoules is equal to 1000 photon torpedoes!!! cool beans So for simple math, what would half of that be? I'm thinking that 500 Photon torpedoes would equal 507.5 megajoules. I am wrong though as it turns out, "These are detonated in concert with intentional overloads of all fusion reaction chambers. The release yield of the secondary system is calculated to be 109 megajoules, roughly equivalent to 500 photon torpedoes". Ok? so 500 torps are equal to 109 megajoules... so then 500 torpedoes(109 megajoules) X 2 = 218 megajoules..... damn it!!!

00111010 01000100 wrote: ↑Thu Jul 02, 2020 3:22 amI really think they meant to say Gigajoules (or greater).
On page #143, the manual states the following about handheld phaser power cells, "Energy is stored within a replenishable sarium krellide cell. Sarium krellide holds a maximum of 1.3 × 106 megajoules per cubic centimeter, at a maximum leak rate of no more than 1.05 kilojoules per hour. When one considers that the total stored energy of even the Type I phaser, if released all at once, is enough to vaporize three cubic meters of tritanium, it is reassuring to know that a full storage cell cannot be discharged accidentally".
So 500 Photon torpedoes = 109 megajoules... maybe they should pack the torps with a bunch of Sarium Krellide Cells. KA-Boooooooom!!!!

You're reading the numbers wrong - those aren't 1015 and 109 and 103MJ, they're 10^15 and 10^9 10^3 MJ. Several orders of magnitude difference.

McAvoy wrote: ↑Thu Jul 02, 2020 4:17 amThat's also incorrect usage. Should be kilowatts per hour to begin with. Not sure how you measure energy per square measurement.

Kilowatts per hour would imply a rate of power increase, not continuous power. Power density is exactly as they've described it.

I noticed this particular issue a while ago. About thirteen years ago to be precise. Have a read.

Captain Seafort wrote: ↑Thu Jul 02, 2020 1:52 pm

00111010 01000100 wrote: ↑Thu Jul 02, 2020 1:22 amNoticed something funny in the manual tonight (page #151). If the ships self destruct sequence is activated, "Matter from the primary deuterium tankage and the total supply of antimatter from the storage pods on Deck 42 are expelled simultaneously, producing an energy release on the order of 1015 megajoules, roughly equivalent to 1,000 photon torpedoes". So then 1015 Megajoules is equal to 1000 photon torpedoes!!! cool beans So for simple math, what would half of that be? I'm thinking that 500 Photon torpedoes would equal 507.5 megajoules. I am wrong though as it turns out, "These are detonated in concert with intentional overloads of all fusion reaction chambers. The release yield of the secondary system is calculated to be 109 megajoules, roughly equivalent to 500 photon torpedoes". Ok? so 500 torps are equal to 109 megajoules... so then 500 torpedoes(109 megajoules) X 2 = 218 megajoules..... damn it!!!

00111010 01000100 wrote: ↑Thu Jul 02, 2020 3:22 amI really think they meant to say Gigajoules (or greater).
On page #143, the manual states the following about handheld phaser power cells, "Energy is stored within a replenishable sarium krellide cell. Sarium krellide holds a maximum of 1.3 × 106 megajoules per cubic centimeter, at a maximum leak rate of no more than 1.05 kilojoules per hour. When one considers that the total stored energy of even the Type I phaser, if released all at once, is enough to vaporize three cubic meters of tritanium, it is reassuring to know that a full storage cell cannot be discharged accidentally".
So 500 Photon torpedoes = 109 megajoules... maybe they should pack the torps with a bunch of Sarium Krellide Cells. KA-Boooooooom!!!!

You're reading the numbers wrong - those aren't 1015 and 109 and 103MJ, they're 10^15 and 10^9 10^3 MJ. Several orders of magnitude difference.

McAvoy wrote: ↑Thu Jul 02, 2020 4:17 amThat's also incorrect usage. Should be kilowatts per hour to begin with. Not sure how you measure energy per square measurement.

Kilowatts per hour would imply a rate of power increase, not continuous power. Power density is exactly as they've described it.

I noticed this particular issue a while ago. About thirteen years ago to be precise. Have a read.

I wish I could screen shot the tech manual, I did a cut and paste in the Quotations directly from the book. The copy I have may be Americanized as it doesn't have a (^) in any of the listed numbers. So it didn't have a 10^3 or a 10^15?

McAvoy wrote: ↑Thu Jul 02, 2020 4:17 am That's also incorrect usage. Should be kilowatts per hour to begin with. Not sure how you measure energy per square measurement.

While it seems low but total energy discharge for a phased really isn't alot. Seems to have the energy of a very small explosive. Enough to kill people nearby but not enough to do substantial damage.

Also, it is well known not to use the TNG Tech Manual of any kind of measurement reference.

lol, I wouldn't use it for technical guidance (though the title is Technical Manual), I just find the entries highly amusing. Who proof read these?

00111010 01000100 wrote: ↑Thu Jul 02, 2020 10:51 pmI wish I could screen shot the tech manual, I did a cut and paste in the Quotations directly from the book. The copy I have may be Americanized as it doesn't have a (^) in any of the listed numbers. So it didn't have a 10^3 or a 10^15?

10^x is an alternate format that's a lot easier to write on a keyboard. On the page it would have appeared as 10¹⁵, 10⁹ or 10³. Either way they mean the same thing - 10^x or 10^x, both mean 10 to the power x.

I suppose I should back up and explain, I'm a mechanical engineer. Symbols and something to the power of, would've clued me in to larger amounts.
but to show what I mean, this is (exactly) how it is written in this copy.

(Edited to remove copyrighted material)

If it's anything like the copy I've got on my PC, yeah it's really hit and miss on displaying that stuff.

00111010 01000100 wrote: ↑Thu Jul 02, 2020 11:26 pmI suppose I should back up and explain, I'm a mechanical engineer. Symbols and something to the power of, would've clued me in to larger amounts.
but to show what I mean, this is (exactly) how it is written in this copy.

HARDWARE CONFIGURATION AND OPERATION
In the preferred configuration, the starship undergoes rapid vaporization from thermal and mechanical shock caused by a deliberate release of warp engine reactants. Remote computer system decryption algorithms generate one final set of cascade failure commands, and all engine safety interlocks are compromised. Matter from the primary deuterium tankage and the total supply of antimatter from the storage pods on Deck 42 are expelled simultaneously, producing an energy release on the order of 1015 megajoules, roughly equivalent to 1,000 photon torpedoes. If the command links to the engine systems are severed, the secondary destruct system is automatically selected. Ordnance packages are located at key locations around the vehicle, including the antimatter storage pods. These are detonated in concert with intentional overloads of all fusion reaction chambers. The release yield of the secondary system is calculated to be 109 megajoules, roughly equivalent to 500 photon torpedoes. The secondary destruct system becomes the primary system for the Saucer Module in Separated Flight Mode.

In that case your copy is misformatted - mine definitely shows the powers.

So there is a pdf version of the Manual? I got the hardcopy and even a scanned one my computer.

I *{this has been censored for some reason that is not at all reasonably possibly not isn't most definitely not to get in trouble legally...} *, didn't take long either to unzi- *{Again? Dude stop trying to.... nevermind, nothing to see, innocent whistle yadda yadda}* but yeah it's like it's part image-scan and part image-to-text scan, so it didn't actually capture the text in some places yet clearly the pages weren't removed and laid flat, showing it was just opened and laid as-it-would-be-on-a-lap but face-down, so the bend near the bind shows up in the scanned picture.

*{That is most definitely from a copy This Guy owns. Yup. Ignore the growing Pinnochio-esque nose. Uh Huh. ... ... fine, don't believe me on that!}*