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Deepcrush wrote:Let me restate then.

The only purpose of the lance is to take out ships or other items that may be hard or impractical for a normal phaser to engage. You wouldn't want to use it against jemmie bugs or BoPs. That's what the PPCs are for. But, as we saw, a Defiant's forward firepower does nothing against a Dominion Battleship. A lance would have a more 'positive' effect in the matter. That's why its there.

This Battleship was designed to engage the fleet, not the command ship.

A battleship is there to lead the fleet and take out enemy battleships. You don't need to spend the resource of a battleship to take out a few galors or bugs. Use the battleship in the right way or don't use it all.

Since when? If you look at other races battleships, Dominion, Klingon whatever, they were all sat there and pummelled away at the fleet lines. Did they ever go after the GCS ships? no they did not.

What if the enemy fleet is made up of a large number of smaller ships, and has no battleship?

Tsukiyumi wrote:What if the enemy fleet is made up of a large number of smaller ships, and has no battleship?

Another good point. The Romulan fleet for example consists of the Norexan class and the D'Deridex class. A Galaxy, Defiant or Prometheus can handle a D'Deridex, and the Norexan's can be dealt with by other ships. Plus, the Cardassians have no canon battleship.

From what we've got so far, I'd say this thing could comfortably wade through three or four D'Deridex without much trouble. And, that's before we add the torpedoes...

Even a Nebula could probably handle a D'Deridex.

Tsukiyumi wrote:From what we've got so far, I'd say this thing could comfortably wade through three or four D'Deridex without much trouble. And, that's before we add the torpedoes...

Yeah. This thing has surpassed wank and has turned into super-wank. Not even the Klingons build ships like this and their basically Space Orkz.

I'm sure even a Runabout with a skilled enough pilot could take on a D'Deridex.

Tsukiyumi wrote:What if the enemy fleet is made up of a large number of smaller ships, and has no battleship?

Then you don't send ships like this one against it. I think people are mistaking this battleship for a general-purpose warship - it isn't. That's the sort of role a Prommie, or Sov would fill - they've got a balance of speed, firepower, and protection, with an apparent emphasis on the latter two, relative to this ship. A battleship's sole role is as a near-impregnable platform for it's heaviest guns, to knock out enemy heavy ships and fortifications. If you're worried about large numbers of smaller, more mobile ships, then you counter them with smaller, more mobile ships of your own.

Is the current trend of type XII phaser arrays not enough? Why do you want a veritable siege cannon when you have more than enough firepower anyway?

Reliant121 wrote:Is the current trend of type XII phaser arrays not enough? Why do you want a veritable siege cannon when you have more than enough firepower anyway?

If you compare it to he Anglo-German designs pre-WW1, the advance from type-VIII, to type-X, and type-XII is similar to the German progression from 11" to 12" guns. The phaser lance is the British advance from 12", to 13.5", to 15" - it gives a significant advantage to the side with the greater single-hit firepower.

Captain Seafort wrote:

Reliant121 wrote:Is the current trend of type XII phaser arrays not enough? Why do you want a veritable siege cannon when you have more than enough firepower anyway?

If you compare it to he Anglo-German designs pre-WW1, the advance from type-VIII, to type-X, and type-XII is similar to the German progression from 11" to 12" guns. The phaser lance is the British advance from 12", to 13.5", to 15" - it gives a significant advantage to the side with the greater single-hit firepower.

-stubborness- But...But...!!

gah i give up. point conceded. but i still think the balanced is best.

I'm changing my vote to All rounder for the Lance. I think the ability to hit shipyards and defence platforms which we have seen can rip through even powerful ships is a must.

BTW I wouldnt bet on this ship being able to take down multiple enemy capital ships. Its slow speed makes it almost impossible for it to move during combat. It pretty much has to sit there and soak it up. I wouldnt like sending it up against other capital ships with out back up. One on one it is not fantstic. Its only during fleet actions that it will shine.

I'd vote for all if you took off that silly type VIII. There's no need to down grade and I doubt they even build those anymore. Flip it for a type XII and I'd be happy to rejoin the lance party.

I think seafort has it down pat though. People here forget the reason this ship is here. The fact that other races fail to use their ships in a proper manner doesn't mean we have to be just as stupid. The UFP has ships that eat most like candy. What the UFP doesn't have is the firepower to push into enemy space without soaking up a lot of losses.