War of the Week

Re: War of the Week

Postby Deepcrush » Tue Oct 12, 2010 3:10 am

WAR OF THE WEEK #1
Earth Alliance vs Centauri Republic (Early B5 era)

I'm posting a little detail about the main ships in use by each faction so that people can get a basic overall view of things. I included only ships seen on the show. The only ship not listed is the EA's Poseiden Class Carrier but since only two are said to have been built and were not shown on the show, I felt it was okay to leave it out. I can however add in the Poseiden if anyone wants me too as it is a beast of a ship.

Earth Force assets

Omega Class Destroyer - Medium ranged High output pulse/beam particle weapons, high yield fusion warheads, high grade armor plating, class two interceptor system (same as B5 pre-refit), 36 fighters (Aurora, Badger or Thunderbolt). Primary use is as Carrier/Battleship/Command ship.

Nova Class Dreadnought - Short ranged High output pulse plasma weapons, high yield fusion warheads, high grade armor plating, class two interceptor system, 36 fighters (Aurora or Badger). Primary use is as Carrier/Battleship.

Hyperion Class Cruiser - Short ranged Medium output pulse plasma weapons, high yield fusion warheads, medium grade armor plating, class one interceptor system, 6 fighters (Aurora or Badger). Primary use is as short range patrol and escort for larger ships (Omega and Nova).

Olympus Class Corvette - Short ranged Low output pulse plasma weapons, Short ranged Low output rail cannons, Medium ranged Low output missiles, low grade armor plating, class one interceptor system. Primary use is as short range patrol and police duty.

Advantages overall - Armor, the EA uses far more armor on its ships then any other race. Production, the EA has shown an ability to produce more ships then any of the younger races. Fighters, the Starfury is second only to the Minbari Nial fighter. Carriers, all of the modern EA ships such as the Omega and Nova Class carry 36 fighters and the Poseiden carries between 96 and 192 depending on configuration. Interceptors, the EA uses an advanced AA system that not only takes out enemy fighters but enemy weapon's fire.

Centauri Royal Navy assets

Primus Class Battle Cruiser - Medium ranged High output pulse/beam particle weapons, Short range High output mass driver, low grade armor plating, low grade defense shield, 12 Sentri class fighters. Primary use is as Carrier/Command ship.

Vrochan Class Attack Cruiser - Short ranged High output Ion pulse weapons, Medium ranged Low output pulse particle weapons, low grade armor plating, low grade defense shield. Primary use is as close in attack ship.

Advantages overall - Weapons, the Centauri weapons are shown to be extremely powerful and when they make contact and rip through even heavy armor. Range, CR weapons have been shown to for accurate fire at ranges above that of the EA and as such EA ships must close range to engage. Speed, CR ships are faster then their EA counter parts.
Jinsei wa cho no yume, shi no tsubasa no bitodesu
User avatar
Deepcrush
4 Star Admiral
4 Star Admiral
 
Posts: 18917
Joined: Thu Sep 06, 2007 7:15 pm
Location: Arnold, Maryland, USA

Re: War of the Week

Postby Foxfyre » Tue Oct 12, 2010 8:15 pm

Deepcrush wrote:WAR OF THE WEEK #1
Earth Alliance vs Centauri Republic (Early B5 era)

I'm posting a little detail about the main ships in use by each faction so that people can get a basic overall view of things. I included only ships seen on the show. The only ship not listed is the EA's Poseiden Class Carrier but since only two are said to have been built and were not shown on the show, I felt it was okay to leave it out. I can however add in the Poseiden if anyone wants me too as it is a beast of a ship.

Earth Force assets

Omega Class Destroyer - Medium ranged High output pulse/beam particle weapons, high yield fusion warheads, high grade armor plating, class two interceptor system (same as B5 pre-refit), 36 fighters (Aurora, Badger or Thunderbolt). Primary use is as Carrier/Battleship/Command ship.

Nova Class Dreadnought - Short ranged High output pulse plasma weapons, high yield fusion warheads, high grade armor plating, class two interceptor system, 36 fighters (Aurora or Badger). Primary use is as Carrier/Battleship.

Hyperion Class Cruiser - Short ranged Medium output pulse plasma weapons, high yield fusion warheads, medium grade armor plating, class one interceptor system, 6 fighters (Aurora or Badger). Primary use is as short range patrol and escort for larger ships (Omega and Nova).

Olympus Class Corvette - Short ranged Low output pulse plasma weapons, Short ranged Low output rail cannons, Medium ranged Low output missiles, low grade armor plating, class one interceptor system. Primary use is as short range patrol and police duty.

Advantages overall - Armor, the EA uses far more armor on its ships then any other race. Production, the EA has shown an ability to produce more ships then any of the younger races. Fighters, the Starfury is second only to the Minbari Nial fighter. Carriers, all of the modern EA ships such as the Omega and Nova Class carry 36 fighters and the Poseiden carries between 96 and 192 depending on configuration. Interceptors, the EA uses an advanced AA system that not only takes out enemy fighters but enemy weapon's fire.

Centauri Royal Navy assets

Primus Class Battle Cruiser - Medium ranged High output pulse/beam particle weapons, Short range High output mass driver, low grade armor plating, low grade defense shield, 12 Sentri class fighters. Primary use is as Carrier/Command ship.

Vrochan Class Attack Cruiser - Short ranged High output Ion pulse weapons, Medium ranged Low output pulse particle weapons, low grade armor plating, low grade defense shield. Primary use is as close in attack ship.

Advantages overall - Weapons, the Centauri weapons are shown to be extremely powerful and when they make contact and rip through even heavy armor. Range, CR weapons have been shown to for accurate fire at ranges above that of the EA and as such EA ships must close range to engage. Speed, CR ships are faster then their EA counter parts.


I would say on this one it leans towards the Centauri however EA ships seem to be able to take a bit of a pounding. Overall I argee that Centauri weapons and over all speed are a serious advanatage here. One thing you forgot to mention is manuverability (not the same thing as speed in my mind), some EA ships have large rotating sections which restricts there ability to manuver. This could easily hamper EA commanders ability to shape and control the battlefield so to speak and allow the Centuri to stay out of A EA ships line of fire (seems most EA ships have a rather limited field of fire with there heavy guns (take a good look at the Omega class).
Genius insania et conseri manum
User avatar
Foxfyre
Lieutenant Commander
Lieutenant Commander
 
Posts: 1002
Joined: Tue Dec 11, 2007 4:16 am
Location: TEXAS!!!!!!

Re: War of the Week

Postby Deepcrush » Tue Oct 12, 2010 8:56 pm

Foxfyre wrote:I would say on this one it leans towards the Centauri however EA ships seem to be able to take a bit of a pounding. Overall I argee that Centauri weapons and over all speed are a serious advanatage here.


Its a tough trade off that different groups have to make. EA ships aren't as fast so they have to expect to take a heavier beating in a fight.

Foxfyre wrote:One thing you forgot to mention is manuverability (not the same thing as speed in my mind), some EA ships have large rotating sections which restricts there ability to manuver. This could easily hamper EA commanders ability to shape and control the battlefield so to speak and allow the Centuri to stay out of A EA ships line of fire (seems most EA ships have a rather limited field of fire with there heavy guns (take a good look at the Omega class).


In B5, speed and manuverbility are one in the same. Races that have AG are far faster and more agile with their larger ships where ships without AG are forced to move much slower. What is true is that the higher speed and agility of the CRN can be used to advantage over the EF. Which is why I put it in there.
Jinsei wa cho no yume, shi no tsubasa no bitodesu
User avatar
Deepcrush
4 Star Admiral
4 Star Admiral
 
Posts: 18917
Joined: Thu Sep 06, 2007 7:15 pm
Location: Arnold, Maryland, USA

Re: War of the Week

Postby Foxfyre » Wed Oct 13, 2010 7:14 am

Deepcrush wrote: In B5, speed and manuverbility are one in the same. Races that have AG are far faster and more agile with their larger ships where ships without AG are forced to move much slower. What is true is that the higher speed and agility of the CRN can be used to advantage over the EF. Which is why I put it in there.


Ah I see then, agreed.
Genius insania et conseri manum
User avatar
Foxfyre
Lieutenant Commander
Lieutenant Commander
 
Posts: 1002
Joined: Tue Dec 11, 2007 4:16 am
Location: TEXAS!!!!!!

Re: War of the Week

Postby Tyyr » Wed Oct 13, 2010 11:09 am

With the ability to dictate the range and good long range fire power it's going to be hard for he EA capital ships to force the Centauri into a slugging match. If they can then I think the EA can give as good as it gets if not better.

The only real advantage the EA has are their fighters. The Starfuries will likely sweep the Centauri fighters from the sky. Without the armor and AAA fire to drive them off the Centauri capital ships could find themselves in trouble if the EA stands off and lets the fighters do the work.
User avatar
Tyyr
3 Star Admiral
3 Star Admiral
 
Posts: 10654
Joined: Tue Mar 31, 2009 9:49 pm
Location: Jeri Ryan's Dressing Room, Shhhhh

Re: War of the Week

Postby Lighthawk » Wed Oct 13, 2010 1:07 pm

Tyyr wrote:With the ability to dictate the range and good long range fire power it's going to be hard for he EA capital ships to force the Centauri into a slugging match. If they can then I think the EA can give as good as it gets if not better.

The only real advantage the EA has are their fighters. The Starfuries will likely sweep the Centauri fighters from the sky. Without the armor and AAA fire to drive them off the Centauri capital ships could find themselves in trouble if the EA stands off and lets the fighters do the work.


Agreed on the fighters, they are EA's best weapon in this match up. Once they clear out the Centauri fighters, they can be used to run herd on the Centauri capital ships to try and prevent them from staying at long range. Force them in close to the EA ships and let that heavier armor be the deciding factor.
Image
User avatar
Lighthawk
Rear Admiral
Rear Admiral
 
Posts: 4632
Joined: Fri May 22, 2009 6:55 pm
Location: Missouri, USA, North America, Earth, Sol System, Orion Arm, Milkyway Galaxy, Local Group, Universe

Re: War of the Week

Postby Mark » Wed Oct 13, 2010 7:23 pm

Or just swarm them. If I was an EA Captain, facing off against a Centauri warship, I'd hang back and let my fighters do the work. Without defensive shields, fighters are reletively effective against Cap ships. Without counter measures, they would wreak havoc on a Centauri fleet.

However, as the Centauri have massive resources to draw upon, I don't feel it would be unlikely they would develop counter measures to fighters.

Ultimetely, the power of their ships, and their ruthlessness would take the day IMO.

I'd have the Centauri winning, and bombing Earth back into the stone age after a drawn out war.
They say that in the Army,
the women are mighty fine.
They look like Phyllis Diller,
and walk like Frankenstein.
User avatar
Mark
4 Star Admiral
4 Star Admiral
 
Posts: 17671
Joined: Thu Jul 17, 2008 11:49 pm
Location: Honolulu, Hawaii

Re: War of the Week

Postby Lighthawk » Wed Oct 13, 2010 8:04 pm

Mark wrote:Or just swarm them. If I was an EA Captain, facing off against a Centauri warship, I'd hang back and let my fighters do the work. Without defensive shields, fighters are reletively effective against Cap ships. Without counter measures, they would wreak havoc on a Centauri fleet.


Point, starfuries did swarm down that one suicide Centauri ship, though it wasn't exactly fighting back. But it does prove they have the firepower to get through their defenses to critical systems. I'm still not sure I'd want to let the fighters do all the fighting though, but more let them cripple the other ship; take out it's engines and/or weapons and/or bridge (do Centauri ship's have exposed bridges?) and then move in with the cap ship for the death blows.

However, as the Centauri have massive resources to draw upon, I don't feel it would be unlikely they would develop counter measures to fighters.

Ultimetely, the power of their ships, and their ruthlessness would take the day IMO.

I'd have the Centauri winning, and bombing Earth back into the stone age after a drawn out war.


I'm not sure how up for a drawn out war the Centauri would be. Granted it depends on what started the war, but I think with enough resistance, which the EA showed it can put up during the Mimbari war, I think even if they were winning the Centauri would make or accept a peace agreement before it got to that point.
Image
User avatar
Lighthawk
Rear Admiral
Rear Admiral
 
Posts: 4632
Joined: Fri May 22, 2009 6:55 pm
Location: Missouri, USA, North America, Earth, Sol System, Orion Arm, Milkyway Galaxy, Local Group, Universe

Re: War of the Week

Postby Mark » Wed Oct 13, 2010 8:19 pm

The Centauri are conqurers. They concured and occupied Narn, so there is no reason to believe they'd do anything less to Earth.

Granted, Earth Force seems to be able to produce ships faster than the Centarui, however, the Centauri have been an intergalactic empire since long before Humanity moved into space. You'd almost have to believe they've been involved in more space battles and wars, thus have better "naval" training and experience. Also, the Centauri Republic seems to have more worlds on its side. Earth only has a few colonies for resources to draw upon, and can be worn down.

And don't forget, Earth's resistance in the Minbari war was pathetic. They destroyed exactly TWO Minbari ships. The leaders ship which started the war, and the one Sheridan destroyed with mines.
They say that in the Army,
the women are mighty fine.
They look like Phyllis Diller,
and walk like Frankenstein.
User avatar
Mark
4 Star Admiral
4 Star Admiral
 
Posts: 17671
Joined: Thu Jul 17, 2008 11:49 pm
Location: Honolulu, Hawaii

Re: War of the Week

Postby Lighthawk » Wed Oct 13, 2010 8:53 pm

Mark wrote:The Centauri are conqurers. They concured and occupied Narn, so there is no reason to believe they'd do anything less to Earth.


They had help with that one though, the Shadows took out a nice chunk of the Narn fleet for them. Plus there was already a lot of animosity between them, more hate to work with to drive towards conquest.

Granted, Earth Force seems to be able to produce ships faster than the Centarui, however, the Centauri have been an intergalactic empire since long before Humanity moved into space. You'd almost have to believe they've been involved in more space battles and wars, thus have better "naval" training and experience.


Not necessarily. Given some of the weakness of the Centauri ship design, I think they don't typically engage foes on the same level as them often, but more likely use their relatively advanced tech to steam roll over weaker species.

Also, the Centauri Republic seems to have more worlds on its side. Earth only has a few colonies for resources to draw upon, and can be worn down.


True, that is a big advantage.

And don't forget, Earth's resistance in the Minbari war was pathetic. They destroyed exactly TWO Minbari ships. The leaders ship which started the war, and the one Sheridan destroyed with mines.


Plus fighters and ground forces. And despite that, everyone else seemed to regard Earth's resistance to the Mimbari assault as nothing short of miraculous. True enough, the EA got it's ass kicked outright, but from the way Lando talked about it in the narration, he seemed amazed the war lasted any length of time at all.
Image
User avatar
Lighthawk
Rear Admiral
Rear Admiral
 
Posts: 4632
Joined: Fri May 22, 2009 6:55 pm
Location: Missouri, USA, North America, Earth, Sol System, Orion Arm, Milkyway Galaxy, Local Group, Universe

Re: War of the Week

Postby Tyyr » Wed Oct 13, 2010 9:58 pm

And the Mimbari are head and shoulders over everyone else in terms of their ships.
User avatar
Tyyr
3 Star Admiral
3 Star Admiral
 
Posts: 10654
Joined: Tue Mar 31, 2009 9:49 pm
Location: Jeri Ryan's Dressing Room, Shhhhh

Re: War of the Week

Postby Deepcrush » Wed Oct 13, 2010 10:05 pm

I'm going to sit out of these wars for the most part so that I can be the non-party info guy... but...

Mark wrote:And don't forget, Earth's resistance in the Minbari war was pathetic. They destroyed exactly TWO Minbari ships. The leaders ship which started the war, and the one Sheridan destroyed with mines.


This is wrong. First Dukat's ship wasn't destroyed, just crippled. The Black Star was destroyed along with three of her escort ships. One Minbari Sharlin was rammed by an EF Nova. Also important to remember is that the Minbari took two years to push EF back to Sol Sector which means their efforts must have been paying off to some degree in other battles.

As to the number of worlds that each race has. In B5, each race draws most of its resources from its homeworld and not from colonies. Colonies are minor issues at best in B5. That being said, according to Londo in the series Pilot the EA is about as big as the CR at the start of the show.

****************************

As to be fair, I'm also going to point out issues for the other field of things. AKA, pro-CR or anti-EA.

Defensive shields, the CRN does in fact have these and uses them to counter enemy fighters. While the CRN employs a (relative) small number of fighters, their capital ships are defended by shields against lighter enemy fire. Enemy fighters have to swarm the CRN ships and focus their fire in order to be effective.

Also, while the Starfury is superior to the Sentri in space. Its margin is limited to a one-on-one victory and the Sentri can operate inside of atmo which the Starfury cannot.
Jinsei wa cho no yume, shi no tsubasa no bitodesu
User avatar
Deepcrush
4 Star Admiral
4 Star Admiral
 
Posts: 18917
Joined: Thu Sep 06, 2007 7:15 pm
Location: Arnold, Maryland, USA

Re: War of the Week

Postby kostmayer » Wed Oct 13, 2010 10:12 pm

Deepcrush wrote:Also, while the Starfury is superior to the Sentri in space. Its margin is limited to a one-on-one victory and the Sentri can operate inside of atmo which the Starfury cannot.


Didn't the later model Starfury's have fins attached to allow atmospheric flight?
"You ain't gonna get off down the trail a mile or two, and go missing your wife or something, like our last cook done, are you?"
"My wife is in hell, where I sent her. She could make good biscuits, but her behavior was terrible."
User avatar
kostmayer
Captain
Captain
 
Posts: 2812
Joined: Sun Jul 15, 2007 10:08 am

Re: War of the Week

Postby Lighthawk » Wed Oct 13, 2010 10:16 pm

kostmayer wrote:
Deepcrush wrote:Also, while the Starfury is superior to the Sentri in space. Its margin is limited to a one-on-one victory and the Sentri can operate inside of atmo which the Starfury cannot.


Didn't the later model Starfury's have fins attached to allow atmospheric flight?


It was an entirely new and different starfury as I recall. Bigger, with fins and a nose, more guns, and it was a two person craft.
Image
User avatar
Lighthawk
Rear Admiral
Rear Admiral
 
Posts: 4632
Joined: Fri May 22, 2009 6:55 pm
Location: Missouri, USA, North America, Earth, Sol System, Orion Arm, Milkyway Galaxy, Local Group, Universe

Re: War of the Week

Postby Mark » Wed Oct 13, 2010 11:21 pm

And after our timeframe here.
They say that in the Army,
the women are mighty fine.
They look like Phyllis Diller,
and walk like Frankenstein.
User avatar
Mark
4 Star Admiral
4 Star Admiral
 
Posts: 17671
Joined: Thu Jul 17, 2008 11:49 pm
Location: Honolulu, Hawaii

PreviousNext

Return to Babylon 5

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest

cron