Picard rumour/speculation

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Picard rumour/speculation

Postby Graham Kennedy » Fri Sep 13, 2019 8:46 pm

So here's a... not even sure to call it a rumour. It's a speculation, basically. But an interesting one. I post it merely for discussion, with no claim that it is so.



The gist :

Patrick Stewart is too old to do an ongoing series.
He's also too likely expensive to do an ongoing series.

Therefore... the plan is to have Picard die at the end of season 1. The ship he and his band of merry men have used for the season will then be christened the "Picard".

Mild support... Star Trek Deep Space Nine, Voyager, Enterprise and Discovery have all been named for the titular ship, NOT the main character. This would make the Picard title a bit of a trick - we all think it's for Picard, but it's actually another example of naming the show for the ship.

I don't want to think this is true. But... well.
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Re: Picard rumour/speculation

Postby Sonic Glitch » Sun Sep 15, 2019 11:07 pm

I mean, if we're speculating based on bait and switch name conventions:

"Star Trek: Picard" is actually a Mintakan docudrama telling the story of the life and times and tribulations of The Picard during the rise of a new religion on Mintaka 3 similar to Terras "King of Kings" or "The Ten Commandments."
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Re: Picard rumour/speculation

Postby Atekimogus » Thu Sep 26, 2019 7:06 pm

Graham Kennedy wrote:So here's a... not even sure to call it a rumour. It's a speculation, basically. But an interesting one. I post it merely for discussion, with no claim that it is so.
The gist :

Patrick Stewart is too old to do an ongoing series.
He's also too likely expensive to do an ongoing series.

Therefore... the plan is to have Picard die at the end of season 1. The ship he and his band of merry men have used for the season will then be christened the "Picard".

Mild support... Star Trek Deep Space Nine, Voyager, Enterprise and Discovery have all been named for the titular ship, NOT the main character. This would make the Picard title a bit of a trick - we all think it's for Picard, but it's actually another example of naming the show for the ship.

I don't want to think this is true. But... well.


Haven't watched the video yet but from the gist.....yes, it is true. He is too old. There is - imho - no way he is going to make a multiple seasons series anymore. So either dropping him after a season or keep it a limited one season series makes sense. (Tbh....I never expected more than a mini-series anyhow).

That being said....him dying might not be a bad thing. Everyone dies at some point. If it is handled well I see no problem with that. I highly doubt that they are capable of handling that, but again...if handled well this could be a great thing.



I see the bigger problem in the show named after a ship "Picard". It won't be a "Starfleet" ship I suppose so what are we getting here exactly? I "vigilante" ship? In Star Trek? I am not sure I want to see that.
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Re: Picard rumour/speculation

Postby Graham Kennedy » Thu Sep 26, 2019 11:20 pm

The thing that springs to my mind as a comparison is the HMS Bounty from Star Trek IV.
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Re: Picard rumour/speculation

Postby Nutso » Sat Oct 05, 2019 6:21 pm



Ready to meet Picard's daughter? Go with us down this rabbit hole as we prove to you exactly why we think that is exactly who you are about it meet!


Someone is putting his own detailed in-universe speculation on the mystery girl.
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Re: Picard rumour/speculation

Postby Nutso » Fri Oct 11, 2019 3:28 pm

I think this counts as speculation.


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Re: Picard rumour/speculation

Postby Nutso » Fri Oct 11, 2019 10:36 pm

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Re: Picard rumour/speculation

Postby bladela » Mon Jan 13, 2020 3:48 pm

https://www.npr.org/2020/01/12/79563157 ... QlbiSAMpGI

It wasn't until the producers described the transformed landscape they envisioned for Picard that Stewart got on board. "The Federation" has swung isolationist, and the new Picard is very different.

"My interest was intensely sparked," he said.

When Star Trek: Picard debuts on CBS All Access on Jan. 23, we find the retired leader Earth-bound, living in isolation on a French vineyard.


the enthusiasm I was trying to maintain is largely gone :(
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Re: Picard rumour/speculation

Postby Graham Kennedy » Mon Jan 13, 2020 4:25 pm

bladela wrote:the enthusiasm I was trying to maintain is largely gone :(

One rumour I've heard is even worse - that this series will see the Federation disintegrate completely. The idea being to make the series act as back-story to Discovery, where the far future Discovery is now in doesn't have the Federation.
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Re: Picard rumour/speculation

Postby bladela » Mon Jan 13, 2020 4:48 pm

Graham Kennedy wrote:One rumour I've heard is even worse - that this series will see the Federation disintegrate completely. The idea being to make the series act as back-story to Discovery, where the far future Discovery is now in doesn't have the Federation.


if that's the case, I'll get out of it.

I tolerated discovery, i even had moments when I ALMOST liked it in season two (New Even mainly), but what's too much is too much.
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Re: Picard rumour/speculation

Postby McAvoy » Tue Jan 14, 2020 5:27 am

Graham Kennedy wrote:
bladela wrote:the enthusiasm I was trying to maintain is largely gone :(

One rumour I've heard is even worse - that this series will see the Federation disintegrate completely. The idea being to make the series act as back-story to Discovery, where the far future Discovery is now in doesn't have the Federation.


I have heard the Federation is more isolationist due to the Dominion and the Borg. They are not exploring or doing the 'Star Trek' things.

From what I understand Brexit is an influence on the series.
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Re: Picard rumour/speculation

Postby Graham Kennedy » Tue Jan 14, 2020 1:25 pm

McAvoy wrote:
Graham Kennedy wrote:
bladela wrote:the enthusiasm I was trying to maintain is largely gone :(

One rumour I've heard is even worse - that this series will see the Federation disintegrate completely. The idea being to make the series act as back-story to Discovery, where the far future Discovery is now in doesn't have the Federation.


I have heard the Federation is more isolationist due to the Dominion and the Borg. They are not exploring or doing the 'Star Trek' things.

From what I understand Brexit is an influence on the series.

That comes directly from Patrick Stewart in a recent interview.

“In a way, the world of ‘Next Generation’ had been too perfect and too protected,” he says. “It was the Enterprise. It was a safe world of respect and communication and care and, sometimes, fun.” In “Picard,” the Federation — a union of planets bonded by shared democratic values — has taken an isolationist turn. The new show, Stewart says, “was me responding to the world of Brexit and Trump and feeling, ‘Why hasn’t the Federation changed? Why hasn’t Starfleet changed?’ Maybe they’re not as reliable and trustworthy as we all thought.”
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Re: Picard rumour/speculation

Postby AlexMcpherson79 » Tue Jan 14, 2020 1:50 pm

I'll be honest... I'm not surprised with this. After all, how often did TOS, TNG and DS9 present us with Admirals who didn't quite live up to the promise of what Starfleet and The Federation was? that TNG and DS9 even had an entire situation because the Federation placed their own citizens in danger, resulting in the creation of the Maquis? (I'm talking of course about the whole demilitarized zone and ceding planets thing. Wasn't that Wesley and Traveler-returns episode of TNG a planet that was going to be in Cardassian Territory, not even the DMZ?)

And Look at the episodes of the TNG that the Cardassians were a feature or plot point of: Maxwell went rogue because he thought the Cardassians were u p to something, and though I haven't seen that episode, I swear I saw a summary that basically said he was right? The Chain of Command two-parter demonstrated that there are some captains who run their ships like a military with rules, rather than as a ship of explorers where rank doesn't really matter, because yes Starfleet IS a military of a sort, and oh look that same two parter had that captain because Picard and Beverly were sent on a mission to investigate the Cardies, see if they were up to no good... which they were (I think?), but of an intentional 'hmm this project with chem weapons that doesn't exist might get starfleet attention... sure lets let rumors get out and see who turns up.'

The fact that they sent Picard - a ship captain who probably wasn't anywhere near the right person for the job, and his ships doctor - who definitely wasn't the right person for the job, means something rotten was already in Starfleet.
That the Federation gave up colonies to the cardies, to me, means there was also something rotten there.

And sorry, but while the idea of raining on Gene Roddenberry's idea of starfleet and the federation isn't something I want to do... all of the original four series I've watched held something that did. (TNG, DS9, Voyager, Enterprise).

As for Picard saying they were more evolved, I like to think he says that in a "Say what I wish as if it were true and eventually, it might become more true than it is." ... in that a lot of/most of humanity have evolved sociologically, but you can't quite ever get rid of the darker parts from an entire species/society that, by Picards' time, is made up of various species and cultures.
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Re: Picard rumour/speculation

Postby Graham Kennedy » Tue Jan 14, 2020 6:24 pm

AlexMcpherson79 wrote:I'll be honest... I'm not surprised with this. After all, how often did TOS, TNG and DS9 present us with Admirals who didn't quite live up to the promise of what Starfleet and The Federation was? that TNG and DS9 even had an entire situation because the Federation placed their own citizens in danger, resulting in the creation of the Maquis? (I'm talking of course about the whole demilitarized zone and ceding planets thing. Wasn't that Wesley and Traveler-returns episode of TNG a planet that was going to be in Cardassian Territory, not even the DMZ?)

The thing is that those Admirals were generally depicted as rogues working against a good system, or as straight up incompetents. It's rare indeed that the Federation or Starfleet is shown as 'bad guys' as a matter of deliberate policy. Offhand I can think only of the Insurrection thing and, as you mention, the Maquis situation.

I always said I was hopeful for this show, but that I didn't expect it to be good. Now I'm a lot less hopeful, honestly.

I've generally been baffled by the creative decisions driving what they call Star Trek these days. I genuinely do not understand why they're doing what they're doing. But they certainly seemed determined to do it.
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Re: Picard rumour/speculation

Postby Graham Kennedy » Tue Jan 21, 2020 7:05 pm

First big spoiler rumours. Since they are just rumours and that's what the thread is for, don't see the need to spoiler this. But be warned, these are huge spoilers.

So, here's the plot.

Picard convinces Starfleet to evacuate Romulus when the supernova threatens it. To this end, Starfleet commences building 10,000 new ships at Utopia Planitia.

At the same time, Soong-type androids are being built. The androids rise up and attack UP, destroying the fleet.

Starfleet gives up on the rescue effort, and Spock's back up plan to stop the supernova fails. Picard quits Starfleet in disgust.

Flash forward to the present. The girl who comes to Picard for help is Dahj, who has an organic body but a positronic brain. She was created by Bruce Maddox because manufacture of Soong androids was forbidden after the UP attack. She's killed in episode 1, but has a sister on the Borg cube who is pretending to be a scientist.

The cube is being run by Romulan scientists who are trying to reverse-engineer Borg tech and rehabilitate former drones. This includes a de-Borged Hugh.

The first three episodes happen on Earth entirely. There are no space scenes, no battles, neither is 7 of 9 in them.

There's a suggestion that the Tal Shiar were behind the attack on UP, not the androids. Picard disagrees because why would they stop a rescue effort aimed at saving their own people?

Riker, Geordi and Worf are mentioned but not seen. Data appears only in dreams Picard has.

B4 is kept disassembled - the memory implant didn't take and his brain failed shortly after the end of Nemesis. Maddox analysed the failure and used it to create the organic hybrid twins. Picard considers them to be Data's daughters.

One of the new characters is described as a "Romulan Legolas", raised by "warrior nuns".

Other sources report :

Test screenings have been reported by one source to be "horrendous". The first five episodes received a "C" average score from general audiences in test screenings, and a "D" from those who called themselves Trek fans. A widely held opinion is that it's "really boring".

CBS is claimed to be concerned about Trek in general - the Discovery time jump means a lot of new sets, clothing and ships, thus a big monetary expenditure. It's said that they did this by cutting the budget for Picard, and as a result Picard re-uses a lot of sets, costumes and CGI from Discovery.

Kurtzman is said to be focused on his "Clarice" series (A Silence of the Lambs series), and pretty much ignoring Trek - which is causing frustration all around because of a lack of leadership. Nobody on these shows feels that they're making a quality product.

The announced Noah Hawley ST 4 will not happen - investors have already pulled out. The Tarantino Star Trek film "was never going to happen".

There is talk of selling all of Trek to NBC/Universal. Rumour has it that Seth Macfarlane is very, very keen to get hold of the rights.

All that said, those who have seen clips of "Lower Decks" say it's pretty good - feels like "a funny TNG", possibly along the lines of the Orville in tone.



I don't know if I believe these - there's always a negative buzz around shows these days, and it's wholly possible that trolls have thrown this out there for fun, or negative youtubers are using it to drive views. But on the other hand the source who reported it also reported many of the Rise of Skywalker story leaks, which turned out mostly accurate. That source classes the above as "rumour", so take it or leave it.

For me, I can buy into the plot leaks but it's always more iffy when you're hearing rumours about what's going on behind the scenes. It would not surprise me if any or all of the above were true, but that may well just be my own bias at work. I guess we'll start to know shortly.
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