S36E01: The Magician's Apprentice (spoilers)

What did you think?

5 - Excellent
3
50%
4 - Good
2
33%
3 - Alright
1
17%
2 - Poor
0
No votes
1 - Crap
0
No votes
0 - EXTERMINATE!
0
No votes
 
Total votes : 6

S36E01: The Magician's Apprentice (spoilers)

Postby Captain Seafort » Sat Sep 19, 2015 7:47 pm

A pretty decent start to the new series. The range of technologies in the opening battle had me thinking of Genesis before the Doctor even showed up. Missy was the star of the show, with a few moments which struck me as pure Delgado. The only bit which stood out as possibly poorly done was the end - if the intention was to fool people into thinking Missy and Clara had been killed off, then vaporisation was a poor way to do it, given that death by Dalek has never damaged the body.
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Re: S36E01: The Magician's Apprentice (spoilers)

Postby IanKennedy » Sat Sep 19, 2015 10:30 pm

They did say "maximum extermination", which they've never said before. Also, the Doctor did go back to kill Davros after they were shot. The episode postscript also seemed to suggest that.
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Re: S36E01: The Magician's Apprentice (spoilers)

Postby Graham Kennedy » Sun Sep 20, 2015 12:51 am

IanKennedy wrote:They did say "maximum extermination", which they've never said before.

Actually they have. When they blew up Harriet Jones in "The Stolen Earth", they used Maximum Extermination. It's for when ordinary everyday extermination just isn't evil enough.
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Re: S36E01: The Magician's Apprentice (spoilers)

Postby Graham Kennedy » Sun Sep 20, 2015 1:02 am

My view... loved the Skaro scenes at the start. The Handmines are just so creepy and creative, wonderful bit of Whoism there. And the revelation of who the kid is made me sit up and go WOW!

Clara and Missy were brilliant together. Loved how casual Clara's attitude of "Yeah, big weird crisis going on, better get off to UNIT then" was. One wonders if UNIT has come to see companions/former companions as a valuable high priority asset when it comes to dealing with aliens. That would certainly make sense, given that they would have far more experience of such things than most anybody else. And Clara was very, very good with Missy, very controlled in the face of her taunts. She seemed like a real pro at this kind of thing.

What I did think dragged was the whole "Doctor in the middle ages" section, which just came across as a bit dull after the initial couple of minutes.

And yeah... why try to generate a wow factor by having the daleks blow up the TARDIS and kill Missy and Clara? We know the reset button is going to be hit on that one, so what's the point?

Liked the ending, with the Doctor apparently about to kill Davros. The old "would you kill Hitler as a child" thing is a bit of a cliche, but having it done with Davros just works so nicely, gives it a depth it wouldn't have if they had just invented some evil-guy-of-the-week. Hell, in "let's kill Hitler" they dangled that kind of storyline and then just stuck Hitler in a cupboard after a few minutes and forgot about him. Nice to see them take it on full tilt. I am wanting to see what happens next week, which is about all you could ask for.
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Re: S36E01: The Magician's Apprentice (spoilers)

Postby Mikey » Sun Sep 20, 2015 3:09 pm

The good: Capaldi pulls of some of the best dissembling and deflection - though in a small and subtle way - with Clara in a long and storied history of dissembling and deflection. I also agree that the loop of the Doctor pondering the chance to let young Davros die is done to death, but done very well in this instance... maybe because the Doctor constantly walks the line of fixing problems a/o ultimately being responsible for them. Also agreed that Missy simply stole the show.

The bad: A very early-TNG-ish bit of author's fiat in UNIT's location of the Doctor. It reminded me of Pertwee's "reverse the polarity of the neutron flow," but without the quality of an inside joke or tongue-in-cheek facetiousness. Also, the whole bit of the Doctor hanging out for three weeks in some sort of Dark Ages concert hall making stupid anachronsitic puns was just downright painful to watch. Question: if Beardy was a Dalek, why did Davros have to send snake-guy to find him? Further question: I know Clara was needed by UNIT, but do schoolteachers in the UKoGBaNI have a tendency to look at the window and then just take off for parts unknown in the middle of class?

The sideways: The scenes of snake-guy trying to track down the Doctor, only to have Davros tell him he's doing it wrong, were interminable and unnecessary. The storytelling commentary that (for example) the Doctor had been involved with the Shadow Proclamation did nothing for the story, and was a waste of time. The war scenes from earlier Skaro were great. The hand-mines were suitably creepy, and the opening war scene was Whovian anachronism at it's best - biplanes shooting directed-energy weapons, a soldier about to return that fire with a bow and arrow, all just well-done.

I think that it was a fair episode, that's hurt IMHO by two factors external to the episode itself - a) the hype that BBC-A put into this season premier was ludicrous, and b) I am currently watching the entire three hours of "Genesis of the Daleks (1974.)"

*EDIT* Just listened to Baker, while holding the ignition couple that would destroy the nascent Daleks, speak about the morality of finding a child who you knew would grow into an evil despotic tyrant who would kill millions, and whetehr one would be able to kill that child. IDK if Moffatt &co. had that in mind when writing "The Magician's Apprentice," but I'd like to think so.
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Re: S36E01: The Magician's Apprentice (spoilers)

Postby Graham Kennedy » Sun Sep 20, 2015 4:55 pm

Mikey wrote:Further question: I know Clara was needed by UNIT, but do schoolteachers in the UKoGBaNI have a tendency to look at the window and then just take off for parts unknown in the middle of class?

The ones who travel around with Time Lords do it often.

*EDIT* Just listened to Baker, while holding the ignition couple that would destroy the nascent Daleks, speak about the morality of finding a child who you knew would grow into an evil despotic tyrant who would kill millions, and whetehr one would be able to kill that child. IDK if Moffatt &co. had that in mind when writing "The Magician's Apprentice," but I'd like to think so.

I think it's very likely. Certainly they were influenced by Genesis in depicting the anachronisms of the war, it was that episode that introduced it. So they definitely had it in mind for the background to this one.
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Re: S36E01: The Magician's Apprentice (spoilers)

Postby Griffin » Sun Sep 20, 2015 5:50 pm

Graham Kennedy wrote:
Mikey wrote:*EDIT* Just listened to Baker, while holding the ignition couple that would destroy the nascent Daleks, speak about the morality of finding a child who you knew would grow into an evil despotic tyrant who would kill millions, and whetehr one would be able to kill that child. IDK if Moffatt &co. had that in mind when writing "The Magician's Apprentice," but I'd like to think so.

I think it's very likely. Certainly they were influenced by Genesis in depicting the anachronisms of the war, it was that episode that introduced it. So they definitely had it in mind for the background to this one.

Given that Davros played the exact scene in question to taunt the Doctor, it say it's incredibly likely.
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Re: S36E01: The Magician's Apprentice (spoilers)

Postby RK_Striker_JK_5 » Sun Sep 20, 2015 11:16 pm

Overall loved it... except UNIT seemed to be at the level of Keystone Cops. Other than that? Holy SHIT! :shock:

Also, hand mines. A muddy hand with a fake eye on the palm and creepy as fuck.
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