Fix the Imperium of Man

Re: Fix the Imperium of Man

Postby Mikey » Sat Sep 24, 2011 1:40 am

To me, that situation is the difference between positive cooperation on one hand, and muddling of roles and poor definition of bounds of authority on the other. While the Inquisition has its own forces to prosecute its business - Grey Knights, Deathwatch, and Sisters of Battle, not to mention Inquisitorial stormtroopers - they should be able to ask for assistance in operations of a scale which is beyond their means. They shouldn't be able to use a chapter of Astartes as asingle inquisitor's lackeys and bounty hunters. Any assistance a chapter gives the Inquisition should rightly be regarded as an expression of goodwill by the SM, not as required by the Inquisition's status.
I can't stand nothing dull
I got the high gloss luster
I'll massacre your ass as fast
as Bull offed Custer
User avatar
Mikey
Fleet Admiral
Fleet Admiral
 
Posts: 35525
Joined: Fri Jul 27, 2007 2:04 am
Location: down the shore, New Jersey, USA

Re: Fix the Imperium of Man

Postby Deepcrush » Sat Sep 24, 2011 2:06 am

Very well spoken.
Jinsei wa cho no yume, shi no tsubasa no bitodesu
User avatar
Deepcrush
4 Star Admiral
4 Star Admiral
 
Posts: 18917
Joined: Thu Sep 06, 2007 7:15 pm
Location: Arnold, Maryland, USA

Re: Fix the Imperium of Man

Postby alexmann » Sun Jan 22, 2012 8:42 pm

The first thing to do is to unify the armed forces. Then get the inquisition to realise that they aren't everything and have them supporting the military, not the other way round. Also, sort out the damned records! Get them making technological advances.
ImageImage
User avatar
alexmann
Lieutenant Commander
Lieutenant Commander
 
Posts: 912
Joined: Fri May 27, 2011 5:52 pm
Location: I'm in your mind!

Re: Fix the Imperium of Man

Postby Mikey » Mon Jan 23, 2012 1:00 pm

alexmann wrote:The first thing to do is to unify the armed forces. Then get the inquisition to realise that they aren't everything and have them supporting the military, not the other way round. Also, sort out the damned records! Get them making technological advances.


There has to be a change in thinking before that can be done, much as I agree. The division of the Army into the guard, the navy, and the PDF's was done as a reaction the same as the splitting of the Legions into chapters - because of wholesale defections during the HH. You'd have to convince everyone that such a thing couldn't happen again before you can reunite the armed forces.
I can't stand nothing dull
I got the high gloss luster
I'll massacre your ass as fast
as Bull offed Custer
User avatar
Mikey
Fleet Admiral
Fleet Admiral
 
Posts: 35525
Joined: Fri Jul 27, 2007 2:04 am
Location: down the shore, New Jersey, USA

Re: Fix the Imperium of Man

Postby Deepcrush » Mon Jan 23, 2012 2:44 pm

Due to the constant threat of Chaos, it would be impossible to removes such a problem.
Jinsei wa cho no yume, shi no tsubasa no bitodesu
User avatar
Deepcrush
4 Star Admiral
4 Star Admiral
 
Posts: 18917
Joined: Thu Sep 06, 2007 7:15 pm
Location: Arnold, Maryland, USA

Re: Fix the Imperium of Man

Postby Mikey » Mon Jan 23, 2012 4:36 pm

Deepcrush wrote:Due to the constant threat of Chaos, it would be impossible to removes such a problem.


Unfortunately, you're absolutely correct. You can't dismiss the ideas of heresy and defection to Chaos as paranoia if those things really do happen.
I can't stand nothing dull
I got the high gloss luster
I'll massacre your ass as fast
as Bull offed Custer
User avatar
Mikey
Fleet Admiral
Fleet Admiral
 
Posts: 35525
Joined: Fri Jul 27, 2007 2:04 am
Location: down the shore, New Jersey, USA

Re: Fix the Imperium of Man

Postby Deepcrush » Mon Jan 23, 2012 6:49 pm

Unifying the armed forces of the IoM won't really solve any problems. Rather it would create the constant threat of wholesale defections. Rather, the IoM needs to streamline its resources on a smaller scale. Thus rather then needing millions or billions of fodder, the same missions can be completed using thousands or hundreds of thousands of elite troops. Fewer troops means fewer risks of defection and easier to maintain.
Jinsei wa cho no yume, shi no tsubasa no bitodesu
User avatar
Deepcrush
4 Star Admiral
4 Star Admiral
 
Posts: 18917
Joined: Thu Sep 06, 2007 7:15 pm
Location: Arnold, Maryland, USA

Re: Fix the Imperium of Man

Postby Mikey » Mon Jan 23, 2012 9:14 pm

Agreed. The only reason that doesn't happen more often is that you can only raise stormies, etc., from Schola Progenium grads, via intensive Inquisitorial conditioning, or from special locations (Krieg, Cadia, etc.) You can get typical meatgrinder fuel from any and every Imperial world.
I can't stand nothing dull
I got the high gloss luster
I'll massacre your ass as fast
as Bull offed Custer
User avatar
Mikey
Fleet Admiral
Fleet Admiral
 
Posts: 35525
Joined: Fri Jul 27, 2007 2:04 am
Location: down the shore, New Jersey, USA

Re: Fix the Imperium of Man

Postby Deepcrush » Mon Jan 23, 2012 11:18 pm

The key would be to build several "Troop training" worlds and ship tithed recruits to them. It would also make supplying the troops with their new equipment far easier.
Jinsei wa cho no yume, shi no tsubasa no bitodesu
User avatar
Deepcrush
4 Star Admiral
4 Star Admiral
 
Posts: 18917
Joined: Thu Sep 06, 2007 7:15 pm
Location: Arnold, Maryland, USA

Re: Fix the Imperium of Man

Postby Reliant121 » Wed Jan 25, 2012 9:03 am

The problem seems to be a reciprocating cycle of supply and demand. Too many Imperial Guard die, so they get cheap fodder to replace. If the IoM were to begin wholesale training up far fewer but much more advanced troops, could the losses be sustained in the interim period between these advanced troops beginning training and being ready for active duty?
"He was the best of us. They struck without provocation, there was no reason. Animals! Brutal! They deserve no mercy! Strike them down, follow them back to their base and kill all of them, all of them! No mercy!" - Delenn
User avatar
Reliant121
3 Star Admiral
3 Star Admiral
 
Posts: 12249
Joined: Thu Jul 26, 2007 4:00 pm
Location: Hampshire, UK

Re: Fix the Imperium of Man

Postby Mikey » Wed Jan 25, 2012 1:06 pm

I'd have to say "yes," so long as it wasn't an abrupt switch. The IoM produces such staggering amounts of manpower that the IG could continue operating exactly as it does while such a new and improved Guard was being assembled. Consider: psykers are, say, less than 1% of the total population. 1,000 die at the feet of the Golden Throne daily. Yet the choir of the Astronomican is always replenished, there is no shortage of astropaths anywhere, and there's still plenty left over to become full units of battle psykers, Inquisitorial staff, and all the rogue psykers/witches that are about all the time.
I can't stand nothing dull
I got the high gloss luster
I'll massacre your ass as fast
as Bull offed Custer
User avatar
Mikey
Fleet Admiral
Fleet Admiral
 
Posts: 35525
Joined: Fri Jul 27, 2007 2:04 am
Location: down the shore, New Jersey, USA

Re: Fix the Imperium of Man

Postby Deepcrush » Wed Jan 25, 2012 3:01 pm

I wouldn't just say yes as Mikey does but I'll add in "easily". As Mikey pointed out, the IG is massive. We know that while most of the IG is built as fodder, there are a large number of Regiments that have proper training in one field or another. The problem isn't manpower but effort for the IoM. A simple solution for the start would be for newly tithed regiments to be delayed a single year while they are trained and equipped.
Jinsei wa cho no yume, shi no tsubasa no bitodesu
User avatar
Deepcrush
4 Star Admiral
4 Star Admiral
 
Posts: 18917
Joined: Thu Sep 06, 2007 7:15 pm
Location: Arnold, Maryland, USA

Re: Fix the Imperium of Man

Postby alexmann » Wed Jan 25, 2012 6:02 pm

The Imperium is collosal. They were on the brink of conquering the whole galaxy. With that many worlds, I'm gonna say yes.
ImageImage
User avatar
alexmann
Lieutenant Commander
Lieutenant Commander
 
Posts: 912
Joined: Fri May 27, 2011 5:52 pm
Location: I'm in your mind!

Re: Fix the Imperium of Man

Postby Mikey » Wed Jan 25, 2012 7:40 pm

Deep makes another good point - there are IG regiments that prove that you can be IG without being a waste of lasgun charge packs. Cadians, Harakoni, Death Korps of Krieg, Tallarn Desert Raiders, Elysians, Catachans... all of these show vastly improved ability over the typical image of the "find them, give them flashlights, send 'em out" IG. Many of these elite groups further include stormtroopers (or Kasrkin, or grenadiers, or whatever) over and above their own typical troopers. Hell, Scout Trooper MkVenner once killed two daemons with a bayonet. So, not only is possible to raise troops to that level - it's being done.
I can't stand nothing dull
I got the high gloss luster
I'll massacre your ass as fast
as Bull offed Custer
User avatar
Mikey
Fleet Admiral
Fleet Admiral
 
Posts: 35525
Joined: Fri Jul 27, 2007 2:04 am
Location: down the shore, New Jersey, USA

Re: Fix the Imperium of Man

Postby Deepcrush » Wed Jan 25, 2012 8:26 pm

The Vatrians (spelling) in fact are a great example have Lasgun similar to Hellguns, for everyone is their regiments.

Next issue, since the IG have pretty much been covered to death, is the IN.
Jinsei wa cho no yume, shi no tsubasa no bitodesu
User avatar
Deepcrush
4 Star Admiral
4 Star Admiral
 
Posts: 18917
Joined: Thu Sep 06, 2007 7:15 pm
Location: Arnold, Maryland, USA

PreviousNext

Return to Warhammer 40k

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest

cron