Figure this one out, oh ye skeptics

Re: Figure this one out, oh ye skeptics

Postby Mark » Tue May 11, 2010 11:47 pm

Cpl Kendall wrote:s**t in the tub, mush it up and get it down the drain.



Without anyone noticing while watching him bathe?
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Re: Figure this one out, oh ye skeptics

Postby Sionnach Glic » Wed May 12, 2010 11:58 am

Were they actually watching him bathe, though?

And as Seafort correctly points out, you can go weeks without eating. If this guy's been training himself for long enough, not eating for two weeks, and maybe the few days before to allow his digestive system to clear out, wouldn't be too much of a problem. He can get water from the gargling thing (presumably he said it was a daily "requirement") and simply piss in the bath later on.
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Re: Figure this one out, oh ye skeptics

Postby Aaron » Wed May 12, 2010 12:04 pm

Mikey wrote:
Were you already familiar with ways of disposing of s**t, or did you just start to think about it when you read this thread? :lol:


Actually I had the norwalk virus a couple months ago and wound up having an accident in the tub while vomiting...
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Re: Figure this one out, oh ye skeptics

Postby Sionnach Glic » Wed May 12, 2010 12:07 pm

I just noticed that this should really be moved to the science forum.
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Re: Figure this one out, oh ye skeptics

Postby Mikey » Wed May 12, 2010 12:39 pm

Cpl Kendall wrote:Actually I had the norwalk virus


Yeesh. While you were home or in BC?
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Re: Figure this one out, oh ye skeptics

Postby Aaron » Wed May 12, 2010 6:06 pm

Home, coincidently around the same time things thawed out and the city didn't do it's usual massive chlorine dump into the towns water.
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Re: Figure this one out, oh ye skeptics

Postby Mikey » Wed May 12, 2010 6:19 pm

Cpl Kendall wrote:Home, coincidently around the same time things thawed out and the city didn't do it's usual massive chlorine dump into the towns water.


Yeah, quite a coincidence - getting a nasty viral infection and drinking untreated meltwater. :roll:
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Re: Figure this one out, oh ye skeptics

Postby Mark » Wed May 12, 2010 6:53 pm

I'm going to have to call BS on the gargling for life. The human body requires a certain amount of water a day. And a single mouthful (assuming thats what he does...the way I'm reading this he'd have to spit it out or they'd mention "a single mouthful") is not enough to maintain a human body for an extended period of time. And there is no mention of the illnesses that afflict people suffering from starvation or severe dehydration.
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Re: Figure this one out, oh ye skeptics

Postby Captain Seafort » Wed May 12, 2010 7:00 pm

Mark wrote:I'm going to have to call BS on the gargling for life.


And I'm calling BS on any suggestion that he's not taking in the required daily amount of water. The supervision described is nowhere near stringent enough.
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Re: Figure this one out, oh ye skeptics

Postby Sionnach Glic » Wed May 12, 2010 7:08 pm

Indeed. The whole way this investigation was conducted was utter nonsense. Think he's solar powered? Stick him in a glass box in the middle of your garden with no way out. If he's still alive in a month's time, then he's telling the truth.

Mark wrote:I'm going to have to call BS on the gargling for life. The human body requires a certain amount of water a day. And a single mouthful (assuming thats what he does...the way I'm reading this he'd have to spit it out or they'd mention "a single mouthful") is not enough to maintain a human body for an extended period of time. And there is no mention of the illnesses that afflict people suffering from starvation or severe dehydration.


Well there are a few factors which we don't know. How big was the guy? Was he basicaly a walking skeleton, or did he have a lot of fat and muscle mass? How much activity was he doing each day? How much water was he allowed gargle? Was he allowed gargle more than one moutful? Was he observed while he was bathing? Etc. If he'd been training his body in preparation for this for a long time, sat around doing nothing for the two weeks, and was nothing but skin and bones, then I'd wager that he could pull off this stunt.
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Re: Figure this one out, oh ye skeptics

Postby Mikey » Wed May 12, 2010 7:28 pm

Sionnach Glic wrote:If he'd been training his body in preparation for this for a long time, sat around doing nothing for the two weeks, and was nothing but skin and bones


If all that were the case, then what he'd have done is pretty much tantamount to what's been described. Having the somatic control to train yourself to survive with no food and a gargle-ful of water a day is pretty close, in terms of impressiveness, to having the control to completely fast for the same amount of time.
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Re: Figure this one out, oh ye skeptics

Postby Tyyr » Thu May 13, 2010 11:12 am

I disagree. There's a huge difference between training yourself to survive with no food for like three weeks and minimal water and NEVER having to eat or drink EVER.
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Re: Figure this one out, oh ye skeptics

Postby Mikey » Thu May 13, 2010 11:29 am

Tyyr wrote:I disagree. There's a huge difference between training yourself to survive with no food for like three weeks and minimal water and NEVER having to eat or drink EVER.


That's true. I was talking about a comparison between training yourself to fast completely for two weeks vs. training yourself to live on one mouthful of water a day for two weeks.

*EDIT* I got it! Maybe this guy is being sustained by an especially high count of midichlorians!
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Re: Figure this one out, oh ye skeptics

Postby Vic » Thu May 13, 2010 12:02 pm

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Re: Figure this one out, oh ye skeptics

Postby Sionnach Glic » Thu May 13, 2010 1:20 pm

Well this is certainly interesting. The doctor in charge of testing this guy has made these claims twice already in the past decade, each time asking for more funds to properly test it, and has repeatedly turned down the requests of independant teams to come and observe this guy. Also, this isn't the first person to have claimed to be able to live without food or water.

There will be many who maintain that the latest tests prove nothing - and that Mr Jani's survival is down to nothing more mysterious than trickery.

That's the view held by the Indian Rationalist Association, an organisation which publicly campaigns against superstition and spiritual fraudsters.

It has attacked the Indian Ministry of Defence for even agreeing to take part in the tests, accusing them of being 'taken in by the absurd claims of a village fraud'.

Sanal Edamaruku, the association's secretary general, told the Mail: 'I asked to be allowed to send an independent team to survey the room where this test is taking place, but I was repeatedly turned down.

'It is ridiculous to ask people to believe that any man can go 15 days, let alone 70 years, without food or water.

Dr Shah has been in charge of three similar investigations over the past ten years, and he has never allowed independent verification.

'In 2000, he was asking for funds to investigate a man he claimed got his energy from the sun, just like plants do.

'In 2003, he even approached NASA for funds to investigate Mr Jani, claiming astronauts might benefit from the research. This particular hospital, led by this particular doctor, keeps on making these claims without ever producing evidence or publishing research.'

Mr Edamaruku is convinced that Mr Jani must have had access to food and water at the hospital, and does not believe that he was kept under strict supervision around the clock.

He says that whenever the Rationalist Association has investigated individuals making similar claims, all have been exposed as frauds.

In 1999, they investigated a woman who claimed that she was the reincarnation of another Hindu goddess. For five years, she had remained alone in a small closet where it was claimed she had not eaten nor passed any urine or faeces.

In co-operation with the police, investigators from the association searched the room, finding a toilet hidden behind a shelf and a disguised hole through which she received food. Blood tests revealed the presence of glucose, indicating the intake of food.

To further prove the case, a gas was released into the room that made the woman vomit. The contents of her stomach were found to include pieces of recently-eaten chapatti and potatoes.


From the Daily Mail.

My verdict? The entire thing's some sort of scam. Undoubtedly this guy is surviving in just the same way as that woman was. It's quite possible that the whole research team is in on it, in the hope of being given more funding for "testing" (which will probably go into the pockets of the doctor and his staff), and they may well be getting money from people who believe the guy is genuine sending donations in to him.
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