US/UK military ranks

[Lt. Staplic]

I'm not sure if their still actively used, but their still part of the ranking system.

[Sionnach Glic]

What exactly is a warrant officer?

[Captain Seafort]

In the UK, they're simply very senior NCOs. In US they're specialists - in what, and why the positions are given their own rank system, I don't know.

[Mikey]

I think they're obsolete over here, even if the grades are still on the books.

[Mikey]

OK - W/O's are technical specialists. They're considered superior to NCO's but subordinate to officers. They can command units but more often serve as advisors. Still in use by the Army; discontinued in 1975 by the Navy, but reintroduced in 2006 with the Flying Chied Warrant Officer program.

[Mark]

Staplic's listing of USMC ranks in BGG reminded me of something that's been bugging me for a while

These are the US army's non-commissioned ranks:

Private, PFC, Corporal, Sergeant, Staff Sergeant, Sergeant First Class, Master Sergeant, First Sergeant, Sergeant Major, Command Sergeant Major

These are the British army's non-commissioned ranks:

Private, Lance Corporal, Corporal, Sergeant, Staff Sergeant, Warrant Officer Class 2, Warrant Officer Class 1

One has seven grades, the other has ten, even if you ignore US Warrant Officers as something different (why exactly are they dealt with separately to other NCOs anyway?) What are the extra three grades there for?

Actually, the US Army ranks are slightly off....let me help

Private E-1/E-2
PFC E-3
Corporal/Specialist E-4 (Corporal is an NCO, Specialist is not)
Sergeant E-5
Staff Sgt E-6
SFC E-7
Master Sgt E-8
Sgt Maj/Comm Sgt Maj E-9
Sgt Maj of the Army (only one) E-10

[Mark]

In the UK, they're simply very senior NCOs. In US they're specialists - in what, and why the positions are given their own rank system, I don't know.

Most Warrent Officers I knew flew helecoptors.

[Captain Seafort]

Huh? Have you got rid of First Sergeant then?

Either way, what do the extra rank do? There are only so many jobs:

Fireteam iC (L/Cpl)
Section iC (Cpl)
Pl Sgt (Sgt or SSgt)
CQMS (SSgt)
CSM/RQMS (WO2)
RSM (WO1)

How's the US organised?

[Mark]

Private E-1/E-2
PFC E-3
Corporal/Specialist E-4 (Corporal is an NCO, Specialist is not)
Sergeant E-5
Staff Sgt E-6
SFC E-7
Master Sgt/First Sergeant E-8
Sgt Maj/Comm Sgt Maj E-9
Sgt Maj of the Army (only one) E-10


You are absolutely right. I wasn't paying attention. A 1st Sergeant out ranks a Master Sgt. even though they are the same e grade.

[Sionnach Glic]

Alright, so since we're on ranks here's a question that I've never been able to figure out - why do the lower ranks have so many variations?

For example, we've got Corporal. Then we've also got Lance-Corporal. And I think Kendall mentioned Master-Corporal as well. And then there seems to be a platoon's worth of variations on Sargeant. So what's the thinking behind them all? What's the difference in duty between a Corporal and a Lance-Corporal?

[Mikey]

They're simply different ranks (although I was always led to believe that the term "ranks" was for officers and "grades" was used for NCO's) with confusing naming conventions. Ranks names are based on old traditions, and there simply weren't that many traditional terms for enlisted ranks. Therefore, words like "corporal" and "sergeant" were used more than once. Thus, in the U.S., a "staff sergeant" is simply a higher-ranking NCO than a "sergeant." To confuse the matter, much like the naval term "captain" position is sometimes used as well as rank - thus, a "platoon sergeant" is a position, subordinate and advisory to a platoon officer (usually a 2nd lieutenant) but which is generally filled by a staff sergeant... though different things happen in extremis, and the position of platoon sergeant doesn't itself imply or confer a particular rank, or even technically require someone with a rank that has "sergeant" in the title.

Now, in the USMC, there is a rank above staff sergeant known as "gunnery sergeant." This is where the common nickname "Gunny" comes from. However, it's simply a rank, and has nothing to do with whether the gunnery sergeant himself is part of a battery or not.

[Captain Seafort]

And then you've got the hundred and one regimental variations - the cavalry has corporals of horse instead of sergeants, the guards have lance sergeants instead of corporals (although they've still got lance corporals), and the infantry call their staff sergeants colour sergeants.

What's the difference in duty between a Corporal and a Lance-Corporal?

In an infantry section, the section iC is usually a corporal and the 2iC a lance corporal. In theory anyway.