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Seeing as we have a couple military guys, and more than a few gun/weapon enthusists on the forum, I figure it might not be a bad idea to have a thread dedicated to the tools and methods of killing our fellow humans.

So to kick things off, how about combat shotguns? Anyone have any feelings one way or another towards military shotguns? How do they compare in close quarters fighting compared to say a submachine gun? What kind of ammo would you consider ideal?

AA-12, truly a great weapon. In room clearing, the shotty always wins. Problem is that its not really helpful for anything over 20m. Putting one in a squad is a good idea though.

Deepcrush wrote:AA-12, truly a great weapon. In room clearing, the shotty always wins. Problem is that its not really helpful for anything over 20m. Putting one in a squad is a good idea though.

Doesn't that thing use specialized expensive ammo though?

My personal feelings? Their a specialized weapon; door breaching, non-lethal applications, signalling; all good things for a shotgun. Giving it to someone as a primary weapon, not a fan. From what I understand, in theatre the guy with the 12 gauge also carries a C-7/C8 and only takes out the shotgun for certain things.

Cpl Kendall wrote:Doesn't that thing use specialized expensive ammo though?

It can if you want it too... they've got a couple of neat little rounds for it. Then again, it also feeds off of your off the shelf 12g.

Cpl Kendall wrote:My personal feelings? Their a specialized weapon; door breaching, non-lethal applications, signalling; all good things for a shotgun. Giving it to someone as a primary weapon, not a fan. From what I understand, in theatre the guy with the 12 gauge also carries a C-7/C8 and only takes out the shotgun for certain things.

You're correct, in the field the shotty is like the 203. Its not a primary weapon but its very nice to have from time to time.

Lighthawk wrote:...have a thread dedicated to the tools and methods of killing our fellow humans...

"Fellow humans"? I have mine in case of zombie outbreak.

Seriously, though, they're useful for killing more than just humans, and a lot of them weren't designed for killing humans specifically.

Combat shotguns? I like the USAS-12 and the Saiga-12 on top of Deep's already mentioned (and obviously bad-ass) AA-12. I wonder if they'll make a semi-auto only civilian version of that...?

Tsukiyumi wrote:"Fellow humans"? I have mine in case of zombie outbreak.

Well a zombie is merely a former fellow human, right?

Seriously, though, they're useful for killing more than just humans, and a lot of them weren't designed for killing humans specifically.

True enough, but I think I'd like the focus of this thread to be more towards combat weapons, rather than hunting or sporting ones.



So the thought so far seems to be that a shotgun is a useful weapon, but a specality one. Let one guy carry one for the team. I would guess that everyone else in a close quarters situation would be sporting sub-machine guns or bullpup rifles? And what about a bullpup shotgun?

Lighthawk wrote:So the thought so far seems to be that a shotgun is a useful weapon, but a specality one. Let one guy carry one for the team. I would guess that everyone else in a close quarters situation would be sporting sub-machine guns or bullpup rifles? And what about a bullpup shotgun?

The AA-12 is built like a tommygun, so no bullpup needed. Also, depending on your location and service. For the US, you have either a M4 or M16.

On the field of battle you need a weapon that you can acccurately kill your enemy from a distance as efficiantly as possible. The combat shotgun just doesn't fit that profile. You lose to much in the way of power and accuracy over any significant range. You best bet is still an assault rifle.

Now that said, if I was engaged in urban combat such as clearing a building.......or god help me, overrunning a trench, I'd love to have a good semi-automatic shotgun to fall back on. Its scattershot would let me put more lead downrange into the enemy without aiming. In a perfect world you down down three men with a single shot (not nessessarily kill shots, but get them out of the fight long enough to kill them). Of course, the greatest dangers at that point would be friendly fire and a comparatavly short ammo supply.

IMHO the combat shotgun certainly has a place on the field of combat, just not as a primary weapon. As a primary weapon, I'd still either go with M-16A2 or the AK-47.

Edit

But as a sidearm I'd give the 9mm Berretta a pass on the battlefield. Its great for law enforcement, but if given the choice I'd want something a little heavier, like the trusty and proven .45 Colt 1911 (one of the finest firearms ever made).

I always had a soft spot for the Spaz 12

The Spaz 12 is nice. But after I saw the AA-12, I found the shotgun of my dreams. I have a personal love for the Tommygun. Seeing the shotgun version of a Tompson just makes my life happier!

Deepcrush wrote: I have a personal love for the Tommygun.

I guess we know what your choice of smg will be when the time comes then

Not really, I love the Tommy for is power and look and feel and ammo cap. BUT, the problem is that it's heavy and hard to control if you don't have the mass to balance out the insane recoil. For SMG, the P-90 is the best out there IMO. Anyone can use it and use it well. For mass use I give it to the P-90, for personal use I give it to the Tommy.

Lets save that discussion for the smg section if we get one, no point in firing off too early

colmquinn wrote:Lets save that discussion for the smg section if we get one, no point in firing off too early

I'm sorry! I'm trying to get better at it!

Hopefully you'll have better luck then Mark...