kostmayer wrote:I'm curious as to what you think their CO should have done differently? The Officers were doing their job, responding to a 999 call. Whilst these (very rare) incidents are tragic, we are nowhere near the point where Officers have to be armed to go about their regular duties.
He should have done exactly what I already stated. When you have an active crime site, you don't send in defenseless personnel to look it over until you have secured the site. That's the job of armed officers. If they had been on site for five minutes they could have saved the lives of those two officers. Saying its "rare" that officers die pointless deaths doesn't in any way justify it happening when it can be prevented. Outside of police in the US assigned to major cities, most will never even have to draw their firearms let alone fire them. They won't be shot at either. However they are still trained to use a firearm and equipped with body armor.
GrahamKennedy wrote:Ordinary street officers would carry sticks, pepper spray and tasers; more than enough to deal with household items. This guy had a gun and grenade.
So then two officers in body armor and with guns of their own would have fared better as they would have been equipped to handle the situation.
GrahamKennedy wrote:The vast majority of burglars wouldn't be armed and when confronted would simply run. If cornered most of them just give up, or try fisticuffs. Going armed to burglarise a home is... well I don't have statistics, but it's extremely rare.
But that's not what this is. The guy was already on the run for a double murder - he was on the UK's most wanted list for the last month or so. The news is saying that he made the call to the cops, apparently deliberately intending to lure them into an ambush. After which he simply walked into a police station and surrendered. God knows what his motive was, but it wasn't a burglary gone wrong.
So in other words, this CO sent his officers into an unknown danger and they died for it.
GrahamKennedy wrote:And if cops were going to go armed to all call outs then all cops would have to be armed. The politicians don't want that, the public don't want that, and even the large majority of the police don't want it.
Why would they all have to be armed? Even in the US we have unarmed officers. First a team of armed officers makes sure the area is secure, then the unarmed team takes over. Again its a matter of minutes worth of their time.
GrahamKennedy wrote:Apparently he used a grenade in his previous murder. Somebody caught part of that on a camera, you can see it in this clip. I don't know what he used, but he looks to be pulling a pin and throwing it. Looks like a real grenade, though lord knows where he got them. Somebody bringing something they shouldn't home from Afghanistan maybe?
Most firearms in England come through Ireland, much of those stocks are old NATO munitions out of main land Europe or sometimes out of South America.