Rise Like Lions - Defiant class numbers problem

[Meste17]

So i have read up on information regarding the Defiant class in the mirror universe, and according to the information provided, the Terran Rebellion had the resources to build 24 Defiant-class vessels and yet they only made 11 of these with all of them being destroyed in the fiasco at Empok Nor. That still begs the question what ever happened to the other Defiant-class vessels? Were they even built and if so how many would still be in service by the time Rise Like Lions takes place?

[Mikey]

What is the source for this accounting of resources?

[McAvoy]

Wait what? Mirror Universe lost 11 Defiants? Where did you see that?

[Meste17]

It is in the DS9 novel Saturn's Children

[Mikey]

It is in the DS9 novel Saturn's Children

Ah. I've no clue about that, so I will have to speak in generalities. In no particular order:

1) This number of 11 Defiant-class ships being built is, as you say, from a novel - i.e., non-canon. You can just as easily and plausibly make up a number to suit your own purposes as the author of this novel did. You don't have to accede to his number any more than he has to do so to yours. Obviously you'll have some explaining to do if you claim that the Rebellion built 6,570 Defiants, but...

2)

...had the resources to build 24 Defiant-class vessels and yet they only made 11 of these with all of them being destroyed in the fiasco at Empok Nor. That still begs the question what ever happened to the other Defiant-class vessels? Were they even built and if so how many would still be in service by the time Rise Like Lions takes place?

I believe you touched on the answer to your own question. Having the resources to do something and actually having done it - even having the doing of it be at all feasible or intelligent - are two hugely disparate things. I technically possess the resources to build a 10,000-sq.-ft. aviary for exotic South American birds... I'd have to dismantle my house and subsume all my land to do so, as well as violate a large number of zoning, real estate, building code, and animal handling laws in the process. Who knows what vital projects would have had to have been scrapped in order to build the other thirteen Defiant-class ships, or whether such production would have taken too long to even have been of use? If only eleven such ships were "seen" in the milieu of that book, then it probably stands to reason that there were only eleven.

[McAvoy]

I believe you touched on the answer to your own question. Having the resources to do something and actually having done it - even having the doing of it be at all feasible or intelligent - are two hugely disparate things. I technically possess the resources to build a 10,000-sq.-ft. aviary for exotic South American birds... I'd have to dismantle my house and subsume all my land to do so, as well as violate a large number of zoning, real estate, building code, and animal handling laws in the process. Who knows what vital projects would have had to have been scrapped in order to build the other thirteen Defiant-class ships, or whether such production would have taken too long to even have been of use? If only eleven such ships were "seen" in the milieu of that book, then it probably stands to reason that there were only eleven.

Exactly. Lots of factors in why they didn't build all of them. Shipyard space, manpower, time, other ships more important etc.

Also you should learn to leas with where you got the info from Meste first.

[Teaos]

In universe crew would make sense. They could make 24 but only had crew for 11.

[McAvoy]

Trained crew.

There is an assumption by fans that the Defiant may be a difficult ship to build too.

[Graham Kennedy]

It really doesn't appear to be. In fact it appears to be extremely easy and quick to build them, to judge from the canon.

[Mikey]

It really doesn't appear to be. In fact it appears to be extremely easy and quick to build them, to judge from the canon.

TBF, the class was really only exhumed and made viable at all by deus ex O'Brien.

*EDIT* Or would that more properly be O'Brien ex machina?

[Graham Kennedy]

Nothing suggests that the problems were something only he was qualified to fix, though.

[McAvoy]

It really doesn't appear to be. In fact it appears to be extremely easy and quick to build them, to judge from the canon.

We have seen maybe six total though? If the Defiantis easy to build and considering the ships or at least the Defiant herself is a very powerful ship, there should be more of them. Alot of them. Thry,are practically perfect for war against the Dominion.

[Mikey]

Nothing suggests that the problems were something only he was qualified to fix, though.

Except for the fact that the entire Starfleet R&D department couldn't, and one ops guy working out of a 24-hr. truck stop of a base was able to do it with no help, resources, or budget.

[Mikey]

It really doesn't appear to be. In fact it appears to be extremely easy and quick to build them, to judge from the canon.

We have seen maybe six total though? If the Defiantis easy to build and considering the ships or at least the Defiant herself is a very powerful ship, there should be more of them. Alot of them. Thry,are practically perfect for war against the Dominion.

Didn't we begin this convo by detailing a number of reasons why larger numbers of Defiant-class ships weren't built?

[McAvoy]

It really doesn't appear to be. In fact it appears to be extremely easy and quick to build them, to judge from the canon.

We have seen maybe six total though? If the Defiantis easy to build and considering the ships or at least the Defiant herself is a very powerful ship, there should be more of them. Alot of them. Thry,are practically perfect for war against the Dominion.

Didn't we begin this convo by detailing a number of reasons why larger numbers of Defiant-class ships weren't built?

There is a huge difference between the Mirror Universe and the Primeverse in terms of manpower, resources, experienced specialists, and so forth.