Does main site need rewriting?

Trek Books, Games and General chat

Re: Does main site need rewriting?

Postby Picard » Sat Nov 27, 2010 5:16 pm

Mikey wrote:
Picard wrote:Except that they expected vaporization, as I already proved with quote, you so happily ignore.


I'm not ignoring anything - you're ignoring the fact that you inadvertently proved that out of two people, one expected vaporization and one expected fragmentation.

Picard wrote:Kim never stated fragments were to be results of fragmentation; also incomplete vaporization, when result of explosion, will create fragments.


The only way to get fragments is by fragmentation - that's the definition of fragmentation. Kim stated an expectation about resultant fragments - that means fragmentation would have occurred. Or, perhaps you expect fragments to spring into being amid a spray of rainbows and fairy unicorns?


1) I NEVER said they expected 100% vaporization, but one that will leave only miniature fragments behind (less than 1 centimeter). Both of them expected vaporization, but not complete one. Except if vaporization is not vaporization if it is not complete.
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/fragmentation

2) Read above. There is no contradiction, except one that you are trying to create due to your lack of understanding. If torpedo vaporizes 60% of asteroid, it is still vaporization.
User avatar
Picard
Chief petty officer
Chief petty officer
 
Posts: 43
Joined: Fri Jul 23, 2010 4:34 pm

Re: Does main site need rewriting?

Postby Mikey » Sat Nov 27, 2010 5:28 pm

Then that same torpedo that produces 60% vaporization also produces 40% fragmentation. It doesn't matter if the resultant fragments are <1cm or >2km - they are still fragments. Since you cannot accurately judge the percentage of mass that was vaporized, you cannot use partial vaporization to determine the torpedo's yield.
"We've been over this. We don't shoot first and ask questions later."
"Of course! We never ask questions."
User avatar
Mikey
Fleet Admiral
Fleet Admiral
 
Posts: 33122
Joined: Fri Jul 27, 2007 2:04 am
Location: down the shore, New Jersey, USA

Re: Does main site need rewriting?

Postby Captain Seafort » Sat Nov 27, 2010 6:56 pm

Picard wrote:1) I NEVER said they expected 100% vaporization, but one that will leave only miniature fragments behind (less than 1 centimeter). Both of them expected vaporization, but not complete one. Except if vaporization is not vaporization if it is not complete.
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/fragmentation

2) Read above. There is no contradiction, except one that you are trying to create due to your lack of understanding. If torpedo vaporizes 60% of asteroid, it is still vaporization.


Right, enough of the no-numbers bullshit. Provide specific evidence, with sourcing, of the yield required to fragment an asteroid such that it leaves no fragment more than 1 cm diameter or concede the point.
Only two things are infinite - the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the universe: Albert Einstein.

Across the Universe - Chapter 2 now up
User avatar
Captain Seafort
3 Star Admiral
3 Star Admiral
 
Posts: 14992
Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2007 12:44 pm
Location: Blighty

Re: Does main site need rewriting?

Postby Mikey » Sat Nov 27, 2010 8:22 pm

Also, please include your source material as to exactly how much was fragmented and how much vaporized, so we can see how you arrived at the energy needed for each process.
"We've been over this. We don't shoot first and ask questions later."
"Of course! We never ask questions."
User avatar
Mikey
Fleet Admiral
Fleet Admiral
 
Posts: 33122
Joined: Fri Jul 27, 2007 2:04 am
Location: down the shore, New Jersey, USA

Re: Does main site need rewriting?

Postby Picard » Sun Nov 28, 2010 2:44 pm

Captain Seafort wrote:
Right, enough of the no-numbers bullshit. Provide specific evidence, with sourcing, of the yield required to fragment an asteroid such that it leaves no fragment more than 1 cm diameter or concede the point.


60 to 80%.

Oh joy. A "torpedo glow growth" idiot. I thought so. The PT is moving towards the camera, and is far closer to the camera than it is to Voyager. It will therefore appear to be far larger than it actually is. If you use the actual size of the torp (2 metres) you will find that the rock is actually about 76 metres by 50 metres which, modelling it as a cylinder, gives a volume of 150000 m^3, equivalent to a sphere of diameter 66 metres. Such an asteroid would have a vaporisation energy of 2.2 Mt, a melting energy of 360 kt, and a cratering energy (that required to blast a crater equal to the rock's radius) of 1.4 kt.

The vaporisation energy is obviously too high, both because the asteroid is obviously considerably smaller than a cylinder of its maximum dimensions and because they expected fragmentation, but it can be used as an extreme upper limit, with a more likely yield probably below 1 Mt.


Obviously you did not watch episode, otherwise you would not be saying that. Don't debate something you hardly know anything about. Watch episode and then we can have reasonable debate.
http://picard578.blogspot.com/2010/11/images.html
User avatar
Picard
Chief petty officer
Chief petty officer
 
Posts: 43
Joined: Fri Jul 23, 2010 4:34 pm

Re: Does main site need rewriting?

Postby Captain Seafort » Sun Nov 28, 2010 3:28 pm

Picard wrote:60 to 80%.


Provide your source or concede the point.

Obviously you did not watch episode, otherwise you would not be saying that.


And you've got a fucking resonant cavity between your ears, otherwise you wouldn't be such a fucking idiot. Now, either provide some fucking evidence, that doesn't involve pulling numbers out of your arse or pretending that PTs grow to huge sizes based on them approaching the camera, or fuck off.
Only two things are infinite - the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the universe: Albert Einstein.

Across the Universe - Chapter 2 now up
User avatar
Captain Seafort
3 Star Admiral
3 Star Admiral
 
Posts: 14992
Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2007 12:44 pm
Location: Blighty

Re: Does main site need rewriting?

Postby Tyyr » Sun Nov 28, 2010 10:17 pm

Picard wrote:60 to 80%.

Do you have any source for this or is it just purely a guess?
User avatar
Tyyr
3 Star Admiral
3 Star Admiral
 
Posts: 10654
Joined: Tue Mar 31, 2009 9:49 pm
Location: Jeri Ryan's Dressing Room, Shhhhh

Re: Does main site need rewriting?

Postby Picard » Wed Dec 29, 2010 9:30 pm

Guess.
User avatar
Picard
Chief petty officer
Chief petty officer
 
Posts: 43
Joined: Fri Jul 23, 2010 4:34 pm

Re: Does main site need rewriting?

Postby Tyyr » Thu Dec 30, 2010 1:19 pm

So in essence you've got nothing.
User avatar
Tyyr
3 Star Admiral
3 Star Admiral
 
Posts: 10654
Joined: Tue Mar 31, 2009 9:49 pm
Location: Jeri Ryan's Dressing Room, Shhhhh

Re: Does main site need rewriting?

Postby Mikey » Thu Dec 30, 2010 2:22 pm

In addition to that, it's a guess with no antecedent - it doesn't make any sense, at least to my feeble brain. Seafort asked for the necessary yield, Picard said, "60 - 80%." 60 - 80% of what?
"We've been over this. We don't shoot first and ask questions later."
"Of course! We never ask questions."
User avatar
Mikey
Fleet Admiral
Fleet Admiral
 
Posts: 33122
Joined: Fri Jul 27, 2007 2:04 am
Location: down the shore, New Jersey, USA

Re: Does main site need rewriting?

Postby Mark » Thu Dec 30, 2010 5:48 pm

Picard, I'm curious. Why do you present "guesses" as if they are facts?
They say that in the Army,
the women are mighty fine.
They look like Phyllis Diller,
and walk like Frankenstein.
User avatar
Mark
4 Star Admiral
4 Star Admiral
 
Posts: 17671
Joined: Thu Jul 17, 2008 11:49 pm
Location: Honolulu, Hawaii

Previous

Return to Books / Games / General

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest