Turbolifts

Post by **Mikey** » Sun Mar 16, 2008 12:36 pm

The stuff he used WAS harmful - that's why it rendered the planet uninhabitable. And this had nothing to do with the UFP wanting the territory; the planet was in the Badlands, IIRC.

Jabber Swarky · Post by **Jabber Swarky** » Sun Mar 16, 2008 1:34 pm

Rochey wrote:The public's opinion on gas weapons is much the same as the majority's opinion on nuclear power, in my opinion; they're convinced it's some massive evil because of some past uses or events.

...I thought it was because Gas doesnt discriminate in it's victims and will disperse over a large area, and can have potentially catastrophic environmental effects? That and its REALLY hard to contain, because of Brownian motion.

Oh, and when i say it doesnt discriminate.. im aware that technically bullets dont discriminate, either. But if you shoot a bullet into a room full of civvies, its only going to hurt one, maybe two or three people, whereas gas would effect the whole lot of them.

Aaron · Post by **Aaron** » Sun Mar 16, 2008 1:47 pm

Jabber Swarky wrote: ...I thought it was because Gas doesnt discriminate in it's victims

That was never in dispute and was indeed stated with the "use of gas on civvies by various governments". If you could use it exculsively on soldiers than there wouldn't be a problem. Like say on a starship.

and will disperse over a large area, and can have potentially catastrophic environmental effects? That and its REALLY hard to contain, because of Brownian motion.

Non-persistant nerve agents will break down within 48 hours. Persistant nerve agents and the various blister agents will be present for decades unless the area is decontaminated.

Oh, and when i say it doesnt discriminate.. im aware that technically bullets dont discriminate, either. But if you shoot a bullet into a room full of civvies, its only going to hurt one, maybe two or three people, whereas gas would effect the whole lot of them.

Yes, and? That was never is dispute.

And BTW gas is something of a holdover term, most modern CW's are aerosols.

mlsnoopy · Post by **mlsnoopy** » Sun Mar 16, 2008 7:49 pm

Mikey wrote:The stuff he used WAS harmful - that's why it rendered the planet uninhabitable. And this had nothing to do with the UFP wanting the territory; the planet was in the Badlands, IIRC.

Harmfull to humans. I mean that you could eat that stuff and it would have no effecte on your health, but on the other part made atmosfer lose o2 or something. I don't want to think that Sisko almost commited mass morder.

Weren't the colonis part of the federation, but the peace treaty forced the federation to remove its colonised.

Sionnach Glic · Post by **Sionnach Glic** » Sun Mar 16, 2008 7:57 pm

Although I haven't seen the episode, it does sound like he commited mass murder. If he knew the effects of this gas, and knew that there were people on the planet, then he would have known that they would all die.

Aaron · Post by **Aaron** » Sun Mar 16, 2008 8:12 pm

mlsnoopy wrote:
Harmfull to humans. I mean that you could eat that stuff and it would have no effecte on your health, but on the other part made atmosfer lose o2 or something. I don't want to think that Sisko almost commited mass morder.

He didn't commit mass murder, he attempted it. In his log entry he notes that the Maquis and Cardie colonies would be resettled on other worlds.

Weren't the colonis part of the federation, but the peace treaty forced the federation to remove its colonised.

They were Federation colonies, in the peace treaty that created the DMZ numerous colonies stayed put by choice. Picard tells one of their leaders that they forfeit SF protection in doing so.

Post by **Mikey** » Mon Mar 17, 2008 2:44 am

Big Ben's justification was that the colony waas a Maquis haven. And he only THREATENED mass murder.

Captain Picard's Hair · Mon Mar 17, 2008 3:42 am

His crew questioned him but did not stop him. And it seems starfleet didn't have any major problems with it since he didn't spend the rest of the series in prison. There's a lot of blame to go around here.

mwhittington · Post by **mwhittington** » Mon Mar 17, 2008 5:22 am

He loaded a PT with an extra 400kg of trilithium resin and fired it at the Maquis planet, scattering the resin in the atmosphere and rendering it uninhabitable for 50 years, all to capture Eddington, because Eddington "betrayed the uniform". Commiting attempted mass murder to capture one man....uh, well, at least he didn't destroy his only chance of ever getting home to the AQ...oh, wait, different series.

Tiberius · Post by **Tiberius** » Mon Mar 17, 2008 7:09 am

And on the topic of turbolifts, what's with the one door? Normally elevators have two doors, and inner and an outer set. the outer set stays on the particular floor, while the inner set travels with the lift. Have we seen turbolifts with this?

Post by **Captain Seafort** » Mon Mar 17, 2008 8:36 am

Tiberius wrote:And on the topic of turbolifts, what's with the one door? Normally elevators have two doors, and inner and an outer set. the outer set stays on the particular floor, while the inner set travels with the lift. Have we seen turbolifts with this?

No, but given that turbolifts are cylindrical rather than cuboid they probably rotate to align the internal and external doors.

Tiberius · Post by **Tiberius** » Mon Mar 17, 2008 10:50 am

Huh? The doors must be aligned when the people get in or out, so we would have to see both sets in such a case. And if there is only one set of doors, then either there's be an empty door on the side of the lift where passengers would see the turboshaft rushing past a la DS9, or there would be empty holes in the corridor where the turboshafts go past.

Aaron · Post by **Aaron** » Mon Mar 17, 2008 11:07 am

Captain Picard's Hair wrote:His crew questioned him but did not stop him. And it seems starfleet didn't have any major problems with it since he didn't spend the rest of the series in prison. There's a lot of blame to go around here.

Yes there is, ultimate responsibility lies with Sisko though. He planned and executed the operation, he should be rotting in a cell with Chemical Ali.

Post by **Mikey** » Mon Mar 17, 2008 11:41 am

Cpl Kendall wrote:
Captain Picard's Hair wrote:His crew questioned him but did not stop him. And it seems starfleet didn't have any major problems with it since he didn't spend the rest of the series in prison. There's a lot of blame to go around here.
Yes there is, ultimate responsibility lies with Sisko though. He planned and executed the operation, he should be rotting in a cell with Chemical Ali.

I guess when the UFP abandoned the Maquis territory, they abandoned the Maquis's individual sapient rights as well.

Sionnach Glic · Post by **Sionnach Glic** » Mon Mar 17, 2008 12:03 pm

Although it's surprising for Sisko, I'm hardly surprised with Starfleet being okay with it. This is, after all, the organisation that stands by and watches as billions of people get killed when an asteroid or something slams into their planet. All because they weren't as advanced as Starfleet.
All the UFP's 'holier than thou' crap is just that; crap.