SFDebris: worst case scenario

Voyager

Re: SFDebris: worst case scenario

Postby Deepcrush » Mon Aug 23, 2010 7:03 pm

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Re: SFDebris: worst case scenario

Postby Tyyr » Mon Aug 23, 2010 7:04 pm

Well it was! It had the most potential to really do something different with Trek of any of the series and it pissed it all way trying to be TNG.

Unable to resupply, forced to scrounge to keep the ship going ---- Fuck it, hit the reset button.
Blending two wildly different styles of crew that two hours ago were willing to kill one another ---- Too much work, make them love each other in an episode.
An entire ship full of 20 to 40 year olds in the prime of life ---- Too messy, make them all good little sexless drones.
A captain faced constantly with choosing to uphold principles and damn her crew or bend them and get ahead ---- Nope, she'll always pick Starfleet right and never suffer for it.
Seven, a recovering Borg drone struggling to embrace her humanity ---- Fuck that, ratings are better with her in a catsuit acting like Spock

And the list goes on and on.
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Re: SFDebris: worst case scenario

Postby Deepcrush » Mon Aug 23, 2010 7:08 pm

What's worse is that they even failed just to be TNG.
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Re: SFDebris: worst case scenario

Postby Nutso » Mon Aug 23, 2010 7:15 pm

I think that fits in with the missing tension between terrorists and the guys pursuing the terrorists, now forced to work together. When I read the story about the development of Voyager, the crew would be made up of Maquis and Federation crew, I had this picture in my head of a scene reminiscent of Scotty and the Klingons having a bar fight in Trouble with Tribbles. I really thought the writers have something festering between Maquis and Federation but the groups would eventually overcome their distrust after a couple of years of fighting together and dying together, just straight up struggling to survive together.

kostmayer wrote:What would be even more interesting is if some of the Starfleet personel joined the mutineers.

In TNG:The Pegasus, Picard commented on how a mutiny aboard a Federation Starship was unthinkable. Have there been other examples of a fullscale mutiny in the past on a Starship - can't think of any myself. In the case of the Pegasus, the Captain was betraying Starfleet principles rather then risking the crew to uphold them, which seemed to be the main cause of the mutiny.

For me, around the time Voyager manages to restore contact with the AQ would have been the right time for a mutiny storyline. Learning that their comrades back home had been all but wiped out whilst the Federation played peacemaker would have been just the thing to spark a rebelleion off.

Kostmayer just came up with a fantastic scenario. The Voyager staff couldn't come up with that? Too much tension? Not enough Janeway worship? The professional writers couldn't see two enemies working together would have some issues pop-up? They sure could come up with hologram stories though.
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Re: SFDebris: worst case scenario

Postby Tyyr » Mon Aug 23, 2010 7:18 pm

The writing staff of Voyager was bottom of the barrel most of the time.
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Re: SFDebris: worst case scenario

Postby kostmayer » Mon Aug 23, 2010 7:45 pm

Seven:- Theres got to be some crewmembers on board who lost friends / family at Wolf 359, and would have been a bit miffed about having a Borg sauntering around the ship.

The Maquis: They only joined Voyager out of choice, I would have had Chakotay agreeing to join the crew just to buy time, with a view to overtaking the ship at a later date. Gradually, he'd become more integrated with the Starfleet crew, leading some of the Maquis to wonder where his loyalties really lie.

The ship itself should have degraded / changed over time. Damaged parts being replaced by Delta Quadrant equivalents, improvised replacements for the depleting torpedo stock - that ruddy big cannon they were trying to buy before the Doctor drove the seller to suicide.

Finally, a lone ship out on its own could have harkened back to the early days of the Federation, where a ship would be out exploring in hostile territory for on long missions, with little or no support. The Starfleet crew struggling to cope with the new circumstances, whilst the Maquis would be more adaptable and used to having to make do. The Starfleet crew calling on the Maquis crews experience would give them something to bond over.

Oh, possibly a couple of medeocre characters who thrived on board Voyager, so much so that they didn't want to return.
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Re: SFDebris: worst case scenario

Postby Mikey » Mon Aug 23, 2010 7:48 pm

A sh*tload more of Suder wouldn't have hurt, either.
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Re: SFDebris: worst case scenario

Postby kostmayer » Mon Aug 23, 2010 8:02 pm

Mikey wrote:A sh*tload more of Suder wouldn't have hurt, either.


Hell yes, Brad Dourif is one of the best actors they've ever had on Trek. His character had a lot of potential for character development too. His relationship with Tuvok was one of the more interesting plotlines of Voyager - Suder learning to calm his violent impulses, and Tuuvok gaining more insight into the minds of people who act completely without reason or logic.

One of my fave scenes in DS9 was Odo and Garak sharing a beverage in Way of the Warrior, a nice little follow on from The Die is Cast. Only a small scene, but it shows how their relationship has changed now that Odo and Garak were less of a mystery to each other, not friends exactly, but fellow outsiders.
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Re: SFDebris: worst case scenario

Postby Mark » Wed Aug 25, 2010 6:30 pm

nBSG executed what they should have striven for in Voyager. You could have done alot worse than having the munity succeed and making Chakotay the Captain, and reducing Janeway to a secondary role, usually frothing at the mouth and trying to retake the ship.
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Re: SFDebris: worst case scenario

Postby Sionnach Glic » Wed Aug 25, 2010 6:32 pm

Hell, nBSG's mutiny episodes were probably the best of the final series. If VOY had pulled something similar off it would have been brilliant.
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Re: SFDebris: worst case scenario

Postby kostmayer » Wed Aug 25, 2010 6:43 pm

Sionnach Glic wrote:Hell, nBSG's mutiny episodes were probably the best of the final series. If VOY had pulled something similar off it would have been brilliant.


A Maquis takeover of the ship would have made for an end of series cliffhanger to rival Best of Both Worlds. I reckon a good proportion of viewers would be expecting a reset switch - especially with a death or two. Or ten.
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Re: SFDebris: worst case scenario

Postby Mark » Wed Aug 25, 2010 6:45 pm

Lol, but I would have left the Maquis in charge. They weren't really bad guys after all. Most were ex Starfleet after all. They're not going to murder, rape, or committ genocide. They just want to protect their homes, friends, and family after all.
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Re: SFDebris: worst case scenario

Postby Sionnach Glic » Wed Aug 25, 2010 7:47 pm

You could have had the Maquis seize control of the ship for a full series, with Janeway tagging along in a shuttle trying to work with her allies (both on and off Voyager) to retake the ship.
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Re: SFDebris: worst case scenario

Postby McAvoy » Wed Aug 25, 2010 7:56 pm

So... take Basics Part 1 and 2, instead of Kazon attacking Voyager and eventually taking over the ship, you have the Maquis. Paris gets help from Talaxians with Neelix's help. Spread it over a season or so.
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Re: SFDebris: worst case scenario

Postby Mark » Thu Aug 26, 2010 6:10 pm

I don't really see the Maquis stranding innocent Voyager crewmen on a planet, never to get home, but then keeping them on board wouldn't be smart either.

I'd have had the crew "aquire" another ship somewhere down the road. Older, slower, less Starfleet-ish. Then toss the SF types on that thing. Later on, you could have had a dramatic retaking of Voyager.

I also kind of think the Maquis Raider should have been saved for something important later on in the show.
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