Post War Fed Shipbuilding

Deep Space Nine

Re: Post War Fed Shipbuilding

Postby Deepcrush » Sat Feb 11, 2012 2:14 pm

If it were a victory for either side, it would likely be treated with more positive response from the Ent-D crew.
Jinsei wa cho no yume, shi no tsubasa no bitodesu
User avatar
Deepcrush
4 Star Admiral
4 Star Admiral
 
Posts: 18917
Joined: Thu Sep 06, 2007 7:15 pm
Location: Arnold, Maryland, USA

Re: Post War Fed Shipbuilding

Postby alexmann » Sat Feb 11, 2012 2:18 pm

WW1 was a victory for the allies and yet we don't view it positively.
ImageImage
User avatar
alexmann
Lieutenant Commander
Lieutenant Commander
 
Posts: 912
Joined: Fri May 27, 2011 5:52 pm
Location: I'm in your mind!

Re: Post War Fed Shipbuilding

Postby Captain Seafort » Sat Feb 11, 2012 2:22 pm

alexmann wrote:I think that Tomed is a UFP system so I would say that the UFP won.


We don't even know what "Tomed" is, let alone what happened. The only facts we do have are that it cost thousands of lives and resulted in the Federation agreeing not to develop cloaking technology and the Romulans disappearing back behind the Neutral Zone. If it was a Federation victory then why, under a Starfleet that less than twenty years earlier was prepared to seize the Praxis opportunity to crush the Klingons utterly, did they agree to an asymmetrical arms control treaty? The logical assumption is that it was a Federation defeat that forced them to sue for peace, while still being strong enough that the Romulans were prepared to take what they could get rather pushing on.
Only two things are infinite - the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the universe: Albert Einstein.

Across the Universe - Chapter 2 now up
User avatar
Captain Seafort
3 Star Admiral
3 Star Admiral
 
Posts: 14877
Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2007 12:44 pm
Location: Blighty

Re: Post War Fed Shipbuilding

Postby Captain Seafort » Sat Feb 11, 2012 2:24 pm

Deepcrush wrote:If it were a victory for either side, it would likely be treated with more positive response from the Ent-D crew.


Why would they treat their own defeat more positively than a draw? In any event, if it was a draw why was it settled by asymmetrical arms control rather than just tweaking the border as they did with the Cardies?
Only two things are infinite - the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the universe: Albert Einstein.

Across the Universe - Chapter 2 now up
User avatar
Captain Seafort
3 Star Admiral
3 Star Admiral
 
Posts: 14877
Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2007 12:44 pm
Location: Blighty

Re: Post War Fed Shipbuilding

Postby alexmann » Sat Feb 11, 2012 2:45 pm

Image
Look near the Romulan/Klingon/Fed border then follow the line up the Rom/Fed border. You'll see it slightly under the line.
http://i1178.photobucket.com/albums/x362/alexmann97/hugetrekmap.jpg
ImageImage
User avatar
alexmann
Lieutenant Commander
Lieutenant Commander
 
Posts: 912
Joined: Fri May 27, 2011 5:52 pm
Location: I'm in your mind!

Re: Post War Fed Shipbuilding

Postby Deepcrush » Sat Feb 11, 2012 2:50 pm

alexmann wrote:WW1 was a victory for the allies and yet we don't view it positively.


The likely answer to that is that the Europeans fucked up the ending so bad that it caused round 2. But at the end of WWI, the allies minus the USA stacked up the positive juice.

Captain Seafort wrote:We don't even know what "Tomed" is, let alone what happened. The only facts we do have are that it cost thousands of lives and resulted in the Federation agreeing not to develop cloaking technology and the Romulans disappearing back behind the Neutral Zone. If it was a Federation victory then why, under a Starfleet that less than twenty years earlier was prepared to seize the Praxis opportunity to crush the Klingons utterly, did they agree to an asymmetrical arms control treaty? The logical assumption is that it was a Federation defeat that forced them to sue for peace, while still being strong enough that the Romulans were prepared to take what they could get rather pushing on.


Hardly logical seeing as the UFP wasn't using cloaks, continued to expand, did sign a treaty that Spock pointed out would be a large scale arms reduction and still flapped their hands at the Romulans over the treaty anyhow. So exactly where is it that the UFP lost...

Captain Seafort wrote:Why would they treat their own defeat more positively than a draw? In any event, if it was a draw why was it settled by asymmetrical arms control rather than just tweaking the border as they did with the Cardies?


A, there's nothing to say its a UFP defeat. B, because they gave up whole sectors of space with the CU and only pretended to give up tech they weren't using at the time with the RSE. Honestly, its more likely that the UFP took the CU more seriously in terms of the peace then they did the RSE.
Jinsei wa cho no yume, shi no tsubasa no bitodesu
User avatar
Deepcrush
4 Star Admiral
4 Star Admiral
 
Posts: 18917
Joined: Thu Sep 06, 2007 7:15 pm
Location: Arnold, Maryland, USA

Re: Post War Fed Shipbuilding

Postby Captain Seafort » Sat Feb 11, 2012 2:51 pm

alexmann wrote:*snip map*

You'll see it slightly under the line.


So, which episode is that map from?
Only two things are infinite - the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the universe: Albert Einstein.

Across the Universe - Chapter 2 now up
User avatar
Captain Seafort
3 Star Admiral
3 Star Admiral
 
Posts: 14877
Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2007 12:44 pm
Location: Blighty

Re: Post War Fed Shipbuilding

Postby Tinadrin Chelnor » Sat Feb 11, 2012 3:00 pm

alexmann wrote:Look near the Romulan/Klingon/Fed border then follow the line up the Rom/Fed border. You'll see it slightly under the line.
http://i1178.photobucket.com/albums/x362/alexmann97/hugetrekmap.jpg


This is non-canon.

Just because someone decides Tomed is a star system when they draw up a non-canon map, until it is seen/mentioned in official canon it means jack.

I have also heard that Tomed was the name of a Romulan flagship that invaded the Federation with a fleet in 2311.

As Seafort pointed out, we know little from canon material.
"If you can't take a little bloody nose, maybe you ought to go back home and crawl under your bed. It's not safe out here. It's wondrous, with treasures to satiate desires both subtle and gross... but it's not for the timid." - Q to Picard.
User avatar
Tinadrin Chelnor
Lieutenant
Lieutenant
 
Posts: 549
Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2010 2:11 am
Location: South and East England, United Kingdom

Re: Post War Fed Shipbuilding

Postby alexmann » Sat Feb 11, 2012 3:08 pm

Tinadrin Chelnor wrote:I have also heard that Tomed was the name of a Romulan flagship that invaded the Federation with a fleet in 2311.


Where from?
ImageImage
User avatar
alexmann
Lieutenant Commander
Lieutenant Commander
 
Posts: 912
Joined: Fri May 27, 2011 5:52 pm
Location: I'm in your mind!

Re: Post War Fed Shipbuilding

Postby Tinadrin Chelnor » Sat Feb 11, 2012 3:20 pm

alexmann wrote:
Tinadrin Chelnor wrote:I have also heard that Tomed was the name of a Romulan flagship that invaded the Federation with a fleet in 2311.


Where from?


Can't remember off-hand... it was one of the Startrek TNG novels I believe. If I remember I'll let you know ;-)
"If you can't take a little bloody nose, maybe you ought to go back home and crawl under your bed. It's not safe out here. It's wondrous, with treasures to satiate desires both subtle and gross... but it's not for the timid." - Q to Picard.
User avatar
Tinadrin Chelnor
Lieutenant
Lieutenant
 
Posts: 549
Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2010 2:11 am
Location: South and East England, United Kingdom

Re: Post War Fed Shipbuilding

Postby Captain Seafort » Sat Feb 11, 2012 3:34 pm

It was one of the Lost Years novels - "Serpent Among the Ruins". Just as canon as the map, obviously.
Only two things are infinite - the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the universe: Albert Einstein.

Across the Universe - Chapter 2 now up
User avatar
Captain Seafort
3 Star Admiral
3 Star Admiral
 
Posts: 14877
Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2007 12:44 pm
Location: Blighty

Re: Post War Fed Shipbuilding

Postby Tinadrin Chelnor » Sat Feb 11, 2012 3:38 pm

Captain Seafort wrote:It was one of the Lost Years novels - "Serpent Among the Ruins". Just as canon as the map, obviously.


Which is precisely the point I was making ;-)

There are plenty of theories, but nothing of an explanation in canon.
"If you can't take a little bloody nose, maybe you ought to go back home and crawl under your bed. It's not safe out here. It's wondrous, with treasures to satiate desires both subtle and gross... but it's not for the timid." - Q to Picard.
User avatar
Tinadrin Chelnor
Lieutenant
Lieutenant
 
Posts: 549
Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2010 2:11 am
Location: South and East England, United Kingdom

Re: Post War Fed Shipbuilding

Postby McAvoy » Sat Feb 11, 2012 7:12 pm

I am with Deep on this one. Chances are that is it was a stalemate. I really just to not see the Romulans going into isolation after this if they won that conflict.

For all we know the Tomed Incident could be about how a fleet of Romulan and Federation ships were wiped out my the Almighty Royal Fleet of Carebears and Unicorns. Romulans said WTF and left because the galaxy became too strange and the Federation was a in a daze willing to grant anything.
"Don't underestimate the power of technobabble: the Federation can win anything with the sheer force of bullshit"
User avatar
McAvoy
Captain
Captain
 
Posts: 3621
Joined: Wed Feb 13, 2008 1:39 am
Location: East Windsor, NJ

Re: Post War Fed Shipbuilding

Postby Deepcrush » Sun Feb 12, 2012 3:08 am

McAvoy wrote:For all we know the Tomed Incident could be about how a fleet of Romulan and Federation ships were wiped out my the Almighty Royal Fleet of Carebears and Unicorns. Romulans said WTF and left because the galaxy became too strange and the Federation was a in a daze willing to grant anything.


:laughroll:
Jinsei wa cho no yume, shi no tsubasa no bitodesu
User avatar
Deepcrush
4 Star Admiral
4 Star Admiral
 
Posts: 18917
Joined: Thu Sep 06, 2007 7:15 pm
Location: Arnold, Maryland, USA

Re: Post War Fed Shipbuilding

Postby alexmann » Tue Feb 14, 2012 12:10 pm

Deepcrush wrote:
McAvoy wrote:For all we know the Tomed Incident could be about how a fleet of Romulan and Federation ships were wiped out my the Almighty Royal Fleet of Carebears and Unicorns. Romulans said WTF and left because the galaxy became too strange and the Federation was a in a daze willing to grant anything.


:laughroll:


More like:

:laughroll: :laughroll: :laughroll: :laughroll: :laughroll: :laughroll: :poke:
ImageImage
User avatar
alexmann
Lieutenant Commander
Lieutenant Commander
 
Posts: 912
Joined: Fri May 27, 2011 5:52 pm
Location: I'm in your mind!

PreviousNext

Return to DS9

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests