Shields - how?

Grundig · Post by **Grundig** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 5:26 pm

I've always wondered how shields work. What are they made of? Charged particles? Shield generators are generally not in physical contact with the shields themselves (that we can see - maybe there's a vent of some kind through the hull), so they can't be sending particles out to form a physical barrier. It also just doesn't seem to me that matter would be strong enough to take any kind of beating, regardless of the configuration. It can't be something incredibly dense like neutronium, because even the small amount that would make up a shield would have a sizable magnetic field (and where would they store it?). So for me, matter is out.

It seems as though they depend on some very strong force to keep them intact against the pounding they take. Perhaps a shield is an artificial boundary of some kind; something akin to a warp field, or a wrinkle in space time...

We also know that shields have a frequency that, when known, allows an enemy to penetrate the shields.

Sionnach Glic · Post by **Sionnach Glic** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 5:49 pm

From what I've heard shields are a physical imposibility, so any explaination would be filled to the brim with technobabble.
As for how they do work, no idea.

Grundig · Post by **Grundig** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 5:56 pm

I see. Hmmm... maybe they work like the slime in Ghostbusters 2. Think happy thoughts!

I wonder what specifically is impossible about them. For me, a technobabble answer can be interesting, even though it's nonsense... For me, it's better than nothing.

Post by **Captain Seafort** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 6:03 pm

The biggest problem is that despite being repeatedly reffered to as "force fields" they aren't, since they act like a wall rather than obeying the distance squared law. While there have been several references to gravitons, suggesting that they're some kind of distortion in space-time, you'd be best off analysing them based on what they do rather than what they are.

Deepcrush · Post by **Deepcrush** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 6:04 pm

It maybe something simple.

An energy field pushing outwards while an equal field is projected outside trying to push in. Between the two, charged atoms that form a compressed layer of energy. This could be the reason that ships can pass throught it at times but energy cannot unless its tuned to match the shields.

Captain Picard's Hair · Fri Dec 28, 2007 6:06 pm

What I've heard is a variation on the "theory" of a warp drive in General Relatavistic terms, that space would be "warped" in such a way around the ship that incoming matter and energy is deflected much as a gravity well would deflect it - just away from the center of the disturbance rather than towards it. The shields, according to this theory, would bend the path of incoming fire away from the ship. They could be described almost as an artificial, inverted gravity well.

Of course, this theory of modern physics would describe something that looks more like a field than the artificial wall portrayed in the fx, but that's the way of things in popular sci-fi. Trek isn't a "hard" sci-fi novel written by a theoretical physicist (obviously!).

Post by **Mikey** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 6:17 pm

Right. That's as close as I understand shield theory, and explains the mention of gravity or graviton sources. Of course, that would produce a field, as CPH mentioned, but that's a small suspension of disbelief compared to other explanations.

Grundig · Post by **Grundig** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 6:24 pm

This all sounds plausible to me. But then, we have cases where sections of the ships shields are failing... Aft shields, ventral shields, etc. My impression is that an inverted gravity well couldn't be sectionalized like that. Plus, how do we account for the weakening of the shields? I know I should probably quit while I'm ahead, but... oh, well.

Post by **Mikey** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 6:25 pm

I hate to cop out, but it's a show, not a documentary. Keep going - that way madness lies.

Deepcrush · Post by **Deepcrush** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 6:26 pm

I was going to say no one here quits but mikey as proven me wrong.

Sionnach Glic · Post by **Sionnach Glic** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 6:42 pm

Don't the shields run off seperate emmiters? If so, it would be less like one big shield and more like a bunch of smaller ones, allowing them to fail seperately.

Or it's just bullshit.

Post by **Mikey** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 9:46 pm

Rochey wrote:Don't the shields run off seperate emmiters? If so, it would be less like one big shield and more like a bunch of smaller ones, allowing them to fail seperately.

Yeah, that's it!

Or it's just bullshit.

Well, yeah, for a RL explanation.

Deepcrush wrote:I was going to say no one here quits but mikey as proven me wrong.

Well, I really had nowhere else to go. Besides, nobody here is paying me.

Blackstar the Chakat · Fri Dec 28, 2007 10:47 pm

Rochey wrote:Or it's just bullshit.

Hey, if it works for government, why not energy shields?

Or maybe it works by magic.

Thorin · Post by **Thorin** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 11:26 pm

It seems gravitons exist as real particles in the 24th century (and 23rd), as shown by various 'graviton' talks. Ships have shown they have complete control over warping space-time (warp travel itself), so should have a lot of control with warping a shield bubble by using space-time. However, the fact they could do this doesn't make it effective.
Ships have also shown they have complete control over controlling 'gravitons', the more quantum aspect of general relativity - as shown by their use of inertial dampers and gravity plating.

So, if you want a quasi-technical explanation, a quantum theory of gravity has evidently been created (and seemingly fully understood) in the 24th century, allowing complete control over gravitational effects - both quantum and space-time related. To me it suggests they use some sort of anti-grav particles, which, interestingly, Einstein thought the 'ether' of space had - the tendancy/rest state is for the universe/vacuum/lack of matter/energy to expand, while that of matter (via gravity) is to contract, giving a static universe. Obviously, since then we figured out the universe is expanding. However, some sort of 'ether' which is full of anti-gravitons has, at some point at least, some basing in real life, meaning that the ship could emit some sort of anti-graivtons (similar to an inversed gravity well, but that would make things a lot more complicated and as we have no quantum theory of gravity, impossible for us to understand even theoretically).

Jordanis · Post by **Jordanis** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 11:52 pm

I have no idea how Trek shields work.

For my own universe, which had Trek Tech as its starting point, I rationalized them as a wall of electrostatic force (being the force that keeps objects from moving through each other). A certain amount of the energy imparted to them is transferred back to the generator in the form of heat, meaning that 'shields at 60%' is more like 'generators have reached 40% of heat capacity before automatic safety shut down'.

This gave me a convenient recharging mechanism, and another mechanism to talk about when speaking of shield strength. Namely, efficiency of generator cooling. It all involves its own wall of technobabble, but I think mine is more coherent. 8)

Trek shields are almost as mysterious as the deflector dish.