Shields - how?

The Next Generation
Sionnach Glic
4 Star Admiral
4 Star Admiral
Posts: 26014
Joined: Fri Jul 13, 2007 10:58 pm
Location: Poblacht na hÉireann, Baile Átha Cliath

Post by Sionnach Glic »

Ah, okay, thanks.
"You've all been selected for this mission because you each have a special skill. Professor Hawking, John Leslie, Phil Neville, the Wu-Tang Clan, Usher, the Sugar Puffs Monster and Daniel Day-Lewis! Welcome to Operation MindFuck!"
Captain Picard's Hair
Rear Admiral
Rear Admiral
Posts: 4042
Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2007 3:58 am
Location: Right here.

Post by Captain Picard's Hair »

Possible, in that there's nothing in Physics that explicitly rules it out; it would just take conditions that we have no clue how to produce in practice (plus, quantities of energy vastly greater than the world's capacity at this time)
"If you can't take a little bloody nose, maybe you ought to go back home and crawl under your bed. It's not safe out here. It's wonderous, with treasures to satiate desires both subtle and gross... but it's not for the timid." Q, Q Who
mlsnoopy
Lieutenant
Lieutenant
Posts: 581
Joined: Sun Dec 16, 2007 4:42 pm
Location: Slovenija

Post by mlsnoopy »

a Federation ship is struck by the cutting laser.
I belive its the tractor beam and the laser.
Are shields even physically possible in the way we see them in Trek?
The moment sombody gets a Nobel price for producing gravitons we can talk abaut it.
Sionnach Glic
4 Star Admiral
4 Star Admiral
Posts: 26014
Joined: Fri Jul 13, 2007 10:58 pm
Location: Poblacht na hÉireann, Baile Átha Cliath

Post by Sionnach Glic »

I belive its the tractor beam and the laser.
I'll reiterate that the tractor beam is not a weapon. It is a system designed to hold a ship in place, or tow it along. Even if they did use a tractor beam (which I doubt), then that would have no bearing on the effectiveness of the actual weapon itself.
"You've all been selected for this mission because you each have a special skill. Professor Hawking, John Leslie, Phil Neville, the Wu-Tang Clan, Usher, the Sugar Puffs Monster and Daniel Day-Lewis! Welcome to Operation MindFuck!"
User avatar
Captain Seafort
4 Star Admiral
4 Star Admiral
Posts: 15548
Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2007 1:44 pm
Location: Blighty

Post by Captain Seafort »

Rochey wrote:I'll reiterate that the tractor beam is not a weapon. It is a system designed to hold a ship in place, or tow it along. Even if they did use a tractor beam (which I doubt), then that would have no bearing on the effectiveness of the actual weapon itself.
It'd probably improve the hit rate somewhat - look at the wallowing turn the E-D made in BoBW II that allowed it to dodge a Borg weapon. There's also the shield-draining thing built into the tractor, which helps somewhat.
Only two things are infinite - the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the universe: Albert Einstein.
Sionnach Glic
4 Star Admiral
4 Star Admiral
Posts: 26014
Joined: Fri Jul 13, 2007 10:58 pm
Location: Poblacht na hÉireann, Baile Átha Cliath

Post by Sionnach Glic »

There's also the shield-draining thing built into the tractor, which helps somewhat.
Hmm, wasn't aware of that bit. Well, I'll concede this point for now, then.
"You've all been selected for this mission because you each have a special skill. Professor Hawking, John Leslie, Phil Neville, the Wu-Tang Clan, Usher, the Sugar Puffs Monster and Daniel Day-Lewis! Welcome to Operation MindFuck!"
mwhittington
Commander
Commander
Posts: 1313
Joined: Tue Sep 04, 2007 4:49 pm
Location: Gridley, CA.

Post by mwhittington »

I thought the tractor beam was used to pull out the section of hull that was cut by the laser. Maybe that was a less powerful version and more localized.
"Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy." -Benjamin Franklin-
ultron2099
Senior chief petty officer
Senior chief petty officer
Posts: 79
Joined: Wed Jun 11, 2008 5:18 pm

Re: Shields - how?

Post by ultron2099 »

Keep in mind i'm not a theoretical physicist however I do watch and read a lot of sci-fi. From what I understand of star trek science, many of the tech the federation uses is based off of particle manipulation. Which particles are being manipulated when hasn't been stated. However, in the early Enterprise show, when they are trying to establish the first force shield aboard ship to contain a biological hazard, they speak of increasing the particle stream density. In another, they mention that an alien device does not employ particle manipulation in their tractor beam as does federation technology. So, combining this with the fact of shield levels, multiple grids such as aft shields, the reason photon torpedoes and quantum torpedoes glow, shield frequency and modulation, and many other aspects into a unified theory. Wish me luck.

Shields are actually a particle manipulator device designed to throw up an intervening barrier at a set distance from the ship. The density level at its highest point is the maximum shield level. Now, the shield modulator holds the particle field in place at a set distance and the entire field is atuned to a specific frequency increasing the ease of containment and replenishment. Now, shields can be reinforced by introducing more particles, but like a phaser bank the shields can only output so much before needing replacement, overhaul, recharging etc... So, in a battle the particle emmitter sends out these particles in a set frequency that the modulator grabs ahold of and places at a certain distance from the ship. Weapons fire thus obliterates a certain amount of these particles, which need replacement, which the particle generator can slowly due on its own. Heat dissapation was once referred too in an enterprise episode. It could be that it refers to the particle emmitter overheating loosing particle generation efficiency, thus keeping it cool and pumping in more energy to help recharge particle field density becomes a must. Thus when Laforge says he's reinforced shields with secondary power, he's increased coolant flow to the particle emmiterrs, channeled energy into them and generated more particles for the shields. As the shields loose density, shield level drops. Also, area's of the ship can loose shields faster then the other. Thus one of the reasons for having a set frequency for the shields, allowing you to manipulate the particles and thus reinforce one section of your shields by moving the particles away from a stronger section. Robbing peter to pay paul so to speak.

Now, as we know starships use subspace fields to negate their inertia thus allowing easier maneuverability at lower cost in fuel. This is explained in the impulse engines which use nuclear reactors to generated a subspace field around the ship and plasma vented propels the ship forward. Photon torpedoes and quantum torpedoes use a similar effect, but at much higher levels. These levels could result in the subspace field atunewaiting to a set electromagnetic field within the visual spectrum. Thus photons are red, quantum torpedoes are blue-white, and romulans shoot green at people. This subspace field has a frequency. If the frequency matches that of the particle field surrounding the ship protecting it, then it is not repelled and passes through harmlessly. Thus why matching frequencies helps in combat.

As for lasers and the deflector dish. I think it was low power inherit in the x-ray lasers of the Talarian weapons system that Riker was referring too when he made his statement. This would explain why the Borg cutting laser easily slices through the hull. It just had alot more power behind it.
Sonic Glitch
Rear Admiral
Rear Admiral
Posts: 6026
Joined: Thu May 22, 2008 2:11 am
Location: Any ol' place here on Earth or in space. You pick the century and I'll pick the spot

Re: Shields - how?

Post by Sonic Glitch »

Welcome to the boards! And what an entrence as well. That has got to be the most in-depth theory put forth for shields that I've read outside of Trek Tech Sites. And it seems plausible too (thats rare)!
"All this has happened before --"
"But it doesn't have to happen again. Not if we make up our minds to change. Take a different path. Right here, right now."
ultron2099
Senior chief petty officer
Senior chief petty officer
Posts: 79
Joined: Wed Jun 11, 2008 5:18 pm

Re: Shields - how?

Post by ultron2099 »

thanks!!
User avatar
Reliant121
3 Star Admiral
3 Star Admiral
Posts: 12263
Joined: Thu Jul 26, 2007 5:00 pm

Re: Shields - how?

Post by Reliant121 »

I call that a Trek-tech Baptism of fire, man!

welcome to the forums. And that was one hellova concept. very good. 9.867473882781983284757537183428/10
ultron2099
Senior chief petty officer
Senior chief petty officer
Posts: 79
Joined: Wed Jun 11, 2008 5:18 pm

Re: Shields - how?

Post by ultron2099 »

but if i don't get atleast a 9.87157983475982375208798347935/10 i won't that set of steak knives!! Come'on, fudge it up a bit, let the guy cut his steak with clean strokes.

:jester:
User avatar
Reliant121
3 Star Admiral
3 Star Admiral
Posts: 12263
Joined: Thu Jul 26, 2007 5:00 pm

Re: Shields - how?

Post by Reliant121 »

oh fine then. you can have 9.9/10 :P

i'm such a softie.
Tsukiyumi
4 Star Admiral
4 Star Admiral
Posts: 21747
Joined: Fri Oct 12, 2007 2:38 pm
Location: Forward Torpedo Tube Twenty. Help!
Contact:

Re: Shields - how?

Post by Tsukiyumi »

Welcome to DITL, ultron. Is that a Star Control reference?

Nice work on the shield theory; that's about what I always figured.
There is only one way of avoiding the war – that is the overthrow of this society. However, as we are too weak for this task, the war is inevitable. -L. Trotsky, 1939
ultron2099
Senior chief petty officer
Senior chief petty officer
Posts: 79
Joined: Wed Jun 11, 2008 5:18 pm

Re: Shields - how?

Post by ultron2099 »

Reliant121 wrote:oh fine then. you can have 9.9/10 :P

i'm such a softie.

you jellen like a fellen.

yeah for me!! :hat:
Post Reply