Was there a purpose to Q?

[Captain Picard's Hair]

This builds on a note I made in the thread about 'All Good Things." Clearly Q delights in toying with the Enterprise crew and Picard in particular. However, in his serious moments he seems to be trying to teach Picard a lesson. This is seen most clearly in "Tapestry" in which a point is made more clearly to Picard personally and AGT in which broader implications are at stake. At the end of AGT, Q tells Picard that the true nature of exploration is of possibilities, a point he demonstrated in a limited way earlier in "Tapestry" in which an entirely different life unfolds for young Jean-Luc Picard as a result of a single change to his timeline. This role for Q wasn't expanded on to it's fullest potential, since by the time he filtered into Voyager his role was mostly as a nuisance.

I was wondering what we might extrapolate from this, though. OOU, Q in his finest moments exemplifies Trek at it's best (and the interest in humanity happens simply because the audience is, well... human). There are other examples of "transcendent" races in Trek which have achieved 'higher planes of existence.' As to Q himself, some of his more serious actions display a deeper interest than mere trouble-making. Even the introduction to the Borg, though it displayed a certain level of callous disregard, was done with an eye toward testing the crew and pushing people out of their comfort zone, as it were.

[Sonic Glitch]

OOU: I'm not sure if initially there was a purpose to Q other than to provide a foil in the Pilot -- and he proved so good they brought him back.I think in TNG his individual appearnces in TNG add up to create a greater purpose for the character. Which is promptly forgotten in DS9 and Voyager (I've actually never seen the Q DS9 episode). Looking at his TNG appearances they all seem to lead up to the moment in All Good Things. I start to wonder if maybe, something in humanity reminded the Q of the way they once were and that's what Q was trying to teach them.

Also, this video (I think it's shown up a few times in the Youtube thread) provides a nice summary of his lessons. In addition the TNG relaunch book "Q&A" is a fantastic look at what Q may have been doing.

[Tsukiyumi]

Now you've reminded me that I wanted a TNG film with Q as the main focus/antagonist. Would've worked a lot better than the Nexus in Generations, and could've been a much more thought-provoking, mind-bending film than what we ended up with in either Insurrection or Nemesis.

[McAvoy]

Problem with Q is that to non fans who would go see the movie would see Q as a fake-God which would be bad for business especially those living in the Bible Belt. Though honestly I do not see the average Joe from the Bible Belt to be that.... stereotypical religious but could you imagine the Paramount upstairs?

I mean Q is perhaps the most powerful being ever encountered in Trek or Sci Fi really.

[Graham Kennedy]

It was always my impression that Q was ultimately trying to help humanity - not out of altruism, but rather self preservation. One can make a strong case for this.

The Q are super intelligent - an IQ of thousands, apparently. And he claimed total knowledge of space and time. How likely is it that a human could actually outwit such a being, seriously? Do we assume that the claims of massive superiority are just bluster? They certainly seem to be everything they claim to be, given what they do. Isn't it far more likely that Picard never outwits Q... but that Q lets Picard win to keep him interested and involved?

I think of it like an adult who is play boxing with a child. You could easily slug the kid and knock him out... but you don't, because you're not trying to fight him but to teach him to fight.

As for why... one day Humanity will become a transcendant species. One day they will be capable of everything the Q are capable of, perhaps even more. Q himself actually admits this in "Hide and Q" :

RIKER : "We're growing. Something about us compels us to learn, explore."
Q : "Yes, the human compulsion. And unfortunately for us, it is a power which will grow stronger century after century, aeon after aeon."
RIKER : "Aeons. Have you any idea how far we'll advance?"
Q : "Perhaps in a future that you cannot yet conceive, even beyond us. So you see, we must know more about this human condition. That's why we've selected you, Riker, to become part of the Q, so that you can bring to us this human need and hunger, that we may understand it."

I think the Q have an eye to that day, and the plan is to ensure that future Humanity is a friend of the Q rather than an enemy.

[Captain Picard's Hair]

It was always my impression that Q was ultimately trying to help humanity - not out of altruism, but rather self preservation. One can make a strong case for this.

The Q are super intelligent - an IQ of thousands, apparently. And he claimed total knowledge of space and time. How likely is it that a human could actually outwit such a being, seriously? Do we assume that the claims of massive superiority are just bluster? They certainly seem to be everything they claim to be, given what they do. Isn't it far more likely that Picard never outwits Q... but that Q lets Picard win to keep him interested and involved?

I think of it like an adult who is play boxing with a child. You could easily slug the kid and knock him out... but you don't, because you're not trying to fight him but to teach him to fight.

As for why... one day Humanity will become a transcendant species. One day they will be capable of everything the Q are capable of, perhaps even more. Q himself actually admits this in "Hide and Q" :

RIKER : "We're growing. Something about us compels us to learn, explore."
Q : "Yes, the human compulsion. And unfortunately for us, it is a power which will grow stronger century after century, aeon after aeon."
RIKER : "Aeons. Have you any idea how far we'll advance?"
Q : "Perhaps in a future that you cannot yet conceive, even beyond us. So you see, we must know more about this human condition. That's why we've selected you, Riker, to become part of the Q, so that you can bring to us this human need and hunger, that we may understand it."

I think the Q have an eye to that day, and the plan is to ensure that future Humanity is a friend of the Q rather than an enemy.

Good catch: I'd forgotten about that.

[Teaos]

See I always thought Q were just humans from the future, when we are further evolved, then they come back to mess with us.

[Captain Picard's Hair]

*

Also, if this is true Q couldn't have allowed humanity to be destroyed in AGT (future humanity wouldn't have let him); it was a game Picard was meant to win.

[Coalition]

Also, if this is true Q couldn't have allowed humanity to be destroyed in AGT (future humanity wouldn't have let him); it was a game Picard was meant to win.

Who said humanity is the only species the Q are watching? They probably have millions of species they are watching across the universe, each with similar potential, but only a few will become Q.

From the 2010 book, a comment on the aliens that created life in the solar system (badly quoted): Life was like a garden. They planted, they nurtured, and sometimes they had to weed. (When the aliens had to decide between the balloon critters in Jupiter or the plant critters in Europa which would live, and which would die.)

If humanity doesn't do well enough, they are merely a foil for another race that will become Q. Thinking that we will automatically become the rulers of reality is species-centric. (That would be one idea for a crossover story, where Picard complains to Q about the latest test, and Q merely remarks that Picard has too much pride. Picard then realizes that Q is testing the newcomers, and the Federation is at the level of the space jellyfish, or a Klingon female, or 18 crewmembers, or the Calamarain, or the Sheriff and his men, or Amanda's parent's house, or a valuable jewel).

Being the subject of Q's tests is better than being one of the foils.

[Captain Picard's Hair]

Also, if this is true Q couldn't have allowed humanity to be destroyed in AGT (future humanity wouldn't have let him); it was a game Picard was meant to win.

Who said humanity is the only species the Q are watching? They probably have millions of species they are watching across the universe, each with similar potential, but only a few will become Q.

From the 2010 book, a comment on the aliens that created life in the solar system (badly quoted): Life was like a garden. They planted, they nurtured, and sometimes they had to weed. (When the aliens had to decide between the balloon critters in Jupiter or the plant critters in Europa which would live, and which would die.)

If humanity doesn't do well enough, they are merely a foil for another race that will become Q. Thinking that we will automatically become the rulers of reality is species-centric. (That would be one idea for a crossover story, where Picard complains to Q about the latest test, and Q merely remarks that Picard has too much pride. Picard then realizes that Q is testing the newcomers, and the Federation is at the level of the space jellyfish, or a Klingon female, or 18 crewmembers, or the Calamarain, or the Sheriff and his men, or Amanda's parent's house, or a valuable jewel).

Being the subject of Q's tests is better than being one of the foils.

Yes, I suppose I made an unwarranted assumption there. The transcript quoted by Graham only says we could become transcendent, not that we will. There may not be a 'future humanity' to challenge Q's actions.

[Sonic Glitch]

It was always my impression that Q was ultimately trying to help humanity - not out of altruism, but rather self preservation. One can make a strong case for this.

The Q are super intelligent - an IQ of thousands, apparently. And he claimed total knowledge of space and time. How likely is it that a human could actually outwit such a being, seriously? Do we assume that the claims of massive superiority are just bluster? They certainly seem to be everything they claim to be, given what they do. Isn't it far more likely that Picard never outwits Q... but that Q lets Picard win to keep him interested and involved?

I think of it like an adult who is play boxing with a child. You could easily slug the kid and knock him out... but you don't, because you're not trying to fight him but to teach him to fight.

As for why... one day Humanity will become a transcendant species. One day they will be capable of everything the Q are capable of, perhaps even more. Q himself actually admits this in "Hide and Q" :

RIKER : "We're growing. Something about us compels us to learn, explore."
Q : "Yes, the human compulsion. And unfortunately for us, it is a power which will grow stronger century after century, aeon after aeon."
RIKER : "Aeons. Have you any idea how far we'll advance?"
Q : "Perhaps in a future that you cannot yet conceive, even beyond us. So you see, we must know more about this human condition. That's why we've selected you, Riker, to become part of the Q, so that you can bring to us this human need and hunger, that we may understand it."

I think the Q have an eye to that day, and the plan is to ensure that future Humanity is a friend of the Q rather than an enemy.

Self-Preservation is actually the kind of angle the "Q&A" book takes. It really is an interesting read. One of the better post-Nemesis TNG books I think.

[RK_Striker_JK_5]

Is that the one where Picard saves the universe by laughing?

[Sonic Glitch]

Is that the one where Picard saves the universe by laughing?

That's the one.

[Teaos]

It is the best medicine.

[RK_Striker_JK_5]

It is the best medicine.

I award you fifty laugh points for this.