Klingons: Honor Optional?

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Teaos
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Re: Klingons: Honor Optional?

Post by Teaos »

For the gretaer good... has there ever been a more evil statement uttered.
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Re: Klingons: Honor Optional?

Post by Sonic Glitch »

Teaos wrote:For the gretaer good... has there ever been a more evil statement uttered.
I don't know...maybe "for the greater good"? :poke: :lol:
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Re: Klingons: Honor Optional?

Post by Captain Seafort »

Teaos wrote:For the gretaer good... has there ever been a more evil statement uttered.
Thousands, if not tens of thousands. "For the greater good", "greatest good for the greatest number", "needs of the many..." etc are pretty much the definition of morality.
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Re: Klingons: Honor Optional?

Post by Mark »

Teaos wrote:For the gretaer good... has there ever been a more evil statement uttered.
How about, "In the name of God." ?

If not, that's a close second :mrgreen:
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Re: Klingons: Honor Optional?

Post by m52nickerson »

Mark wrote:
Teaos wrote:For the gretaer good... has there ever been a more evil statement uttered.
How about, "In the name of God." ?

If not, that's a close second :mrgreen:
A scary close second.
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Re: Klingons: Honor Optional?

Post by Teaos »

Captain Seafort wrote:
Teaos wrote:For the gretaer good... has there ever been a more evil statement uttered.
Thousands, if not tens of thousands. "For the greater good", "greatest good for the greatest number", "needs of the many..." etc are pretty much the definition of morality.
Nope.

The porblem with "The needs of the many" and "the greater good" is that they strip individual rights and require somebody to decide what the greater good is.
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Re: Klingons: Honor Optional?

Post by Captain Seafort »

Teaos wrote:The porblem with "The needs of the many" and "the greater good" is that they strip individual rights and require somebody to decide what the greater good is.
Individual right have their place, but when they conflict with the needs of society (and therefore the individual rights of everyone else) they have to be set aside to some extent. As for the need to have someone deciding what the greater good is, the alternative to that is anarchy.
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Re: Klingons: Honor Optional?

Post by Sionnach Glic »

It all depends on what you mean by "the greater good". The greater good of what?
Most people define the greater good as "what will benefit the majority of the people directly". The problem lies with alternate interpretations like "what will benefit the nation", such as Stalin's view.
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Re: Klingons: Honor Optional?

Post by Mikey »

Love the philosophical discussion, but I noticed one thing I have to address.
m52nickerson wrote:Exactly, if I knife someone in the back and no one knows, I don't embarrass the the Empire or my family, because no one knows.
Again, this shows that blanket generalizations can't be applied to TNG+ era Klingons. We've seen plenty of them that wouldn't do such a thing, even if they would never be found out, because of their own sense of honor.
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Re: Klingons: Honor Optional?

Post by m52nickerson »

Mikey wrote:Love the philosophical discussion, but I noticed one thing I have to address.
m52nickerson wrote:Exactly, if I knife someone in the back and no one knows, I don't embarrass the the Empire or my family, because no one knows.
Again, this shows that blanket generalizations can't be applied to TNG+ era Klingons. We've seen plenty of them that wouldn't do such a thing, even if they would never be found out, because of their own sense of honor.
No doubt. My point was that personal honor seems to take a back seat for some, and still for others when when it conflicts with family honor of the honor of the empire.
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Re: Klingons: Honor Optional?

Post by Mikey »

True. I wasn't disagreeing with you, merely pointing out that this supports my idea thatTNG+ era Klingosn weren't all characterized with a single cookie cutter.
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Re: Klingons: Honor Optional?

Post by Deepcrush »

Rochey wrote:It all depends on what you mean by "the greater good". The greater good of what?
Most people define the greater good as "what will benefit the majority of the people directly". The problem lies with alternate interpretations like "what will benefit the nation", such as Stalin's view.
Stalin wasn't looking for the greater good of Russia. He was looking for the greater good of Stalin.
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