Saber class

The Next Generation
Sionnach Glic
4 Star Admiral
4 Star Admiral
Posts: 26014
Joined: Fri Jul 13, 2007 10:58 pm
Location: Poblacht na hÉireann, Baile Átha Cliath

Re: Saber class

Post by Sionnach Glic »

When looking at the video on youtube. the rollbar each tube fires its own torpedo where the one at the bottom fires more. So there is a reason.
Incorrect. The torps from the rollbar each have the same point of origin.
And how exatcly should the most heavaly armed ship of its generation be used.
If it's intended for use in battles, then it should be designed for use in battles. The GCS is horribly designed when it comes to combat. The fact that it was Starfleet's most powerful ship until the Sovereign came along makes the situation even worse.
Aren't BS the biggest ships with the biggest guns and with the heaviest armour=shields.
Correct. That does not change the fact that it is poorly designed as a battleship.
So a ship that its designiers use as a close support ship.
Again, the fact that Starfleet uses it in one role does not mean that it wouldn't be better in another role, as this ship clearly would be.
Small. As if You can get 10 T into a GCS tube and one into most of the Akiras.
Prove it. We see both dorsal and ventral torp launchers on the Akira firing at least 4 torps from a single launcher. That's not different in any way from the GCS.
"You've all been selected for this mission because you each have a special skill. Professor Hawking, John Leslie, Phil Neville, the Wu-Tang Clan, Usher, the Sugar Puffs Monster and Daniel Day-Lewis! Welcome to Operation MindFuck!"
Tsukiyumi
4 Star Admiral
4 Star Admiral
Posts: 21747
Joined: Fri Oct 12, 2007 2:38 pm
Location: Forward Torpedo Tube Twenty. Help!
Contact:

Re: Saber class

Post by Tsukiyumi »

ChakatBlackstar wrote:And...this is actually on topic :shock: I just 611-RT'd a topic
I was hoping that'd catch on. :D
There is only one way of avoiding the war – that is the overthrow of this society. However, as we are too weak for this task, the war is inevitable. -L. Trotsky, 1939
Captain Picard's Hair
Rear Admiral
Rear Admiral
Posts: 4042
Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2007 3:58 am
Location: Right here.

Re: Saber class

Post by Captain Picard's Hair »

Tsukiyumi wrote:
ChakatBlackstar wrote:And...this is actually on topic :shock: I just 611-RT'd a topic
I was hoping that'd catch on. :D
If you point a TR-116 backwards, won't it shoot YOU? :mrgreen:
"If you can't take a little bloody nose, maybe you ought to go back home and crawl under your bed. It's not safe out here. It's wonderous, with treasures to satiate desires both subtle and gross... but it's not for the timid." Q, Q Who
Captain Picard's Hair
Rear Admiral
Rear Admiral
Posts: 4042
Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2007 3:58 am
Location: Right here.

Re: Saber class

Post by Captain Picard's Hair »

Or, it'll transport itself past you and shoot Teaos, since he's behind you! :shock:
"If you can't take a little bloody nose, maybe you ought to go back home and crawl under your bed. It's not safe out here. It's wonderous, with treasures to satiate desires both subtle and gross... but it's not for the timid." Q, Q Who
Blackstar the Chakat
Banned
Posts: 5594
Joined: Mon Jul 16, 2007 8:53 pm

Re: Saber class

Post by Blackstar the Chakat »

Captain Picard's Hair wrote:
Tsukiyumi wrote:
ChakatBlackstar wrote:And...this is actually on topic :shock: I just 611-RT'd a topic
I was hoping that'd catch on. :D
If you point a TR-116 backwards, won't it shoot YOU? :mrgreen:
It depends on how you hold it.
Mikey
Fleet Admiral
Fleet Admiral
Posts: 35635
Joined: Fri Jul 27, 2007 3:04 am
Commendations: The Daystrom Award
Location: down the shore, New Jersey, USA
Contact:

Re: Saber class

Post by Mikey »

Sorry to borrow your steelo, Blackstar, but you've left me little choice with this one.
ChakatBlackstar wrote:It depends on how you hold it.
That's what SHE said.
I can't stand nothing dull
I got the high gloss luster
I'll massacre your ass as fast
as Bull offed Custer
Tsukiyumi
4 Star Admiral
4 Star Admiral
Posts: 21747
Joined: Fri Oct 12, 2007 2:38 pm
Location: Forward Torpedo Tube Twenty. Help!
Contact:

Re: Saber class

Post by Tsukiyumi »

Zing!

Easy pickins, eh, Mikey? :)
There is only one way of avoiding the war – that is the overthrow of this society. However, as we are too weak for this task, the war is inevitable. -L. Trotsky, 1939
Sionnach Glic
4 Star Admiral
4 Star Admiral
Posts: 26014
Joined: Fri Jul 13, 2007 10:58 pm
Location: Poblacht na hÉireann, Baile Átha Cliath

Re: Saber class

Post by Sionnach Glic »

Damnit, the innuendo is spreading!
"You've all been selected for this mission because you each have a special skill. Professor Hawking, John Leslie, Phil Neville, the Wu-Tang Clan, Usher, the Sugar Puffs Monster and Daniel Day-Lewis! Welcome to Operation MindFuck!"
Mikey
Fleet Admiral
Fleet Admiral
Posts: 35635
Joined: Fri Jul 27, 2007 3:04 am
Commendations: The Daystrom Award
Location: down the shore, New Jersey, USA
Contact:

Re: Saber class

Post by Mikey »

Tsukiyumi wrote:Zing!

Easy pickins, eh, Mikey? :)
I'd have failed the whole board if I didn't do it.
I can't stand nothing dull
I got the high gloss luster
I'll massacre your ass as fast
as Bull offed Custer
User avatar
Deepcrush
4 Star Admiral
4 Star Admiral
Posts: 18917
Joined: Thu Sep 06, 2007 8:15 pm
Location: Arnold, Maryland, USA

Re: Saber class

Post by Deepcrush »

*Shoots mikey in the back of the head with a bolter*

And I'd have failed them if I didn't that. :happydevil:
Jinsei wa cho no yume, shi no tsubasa no bitodesu
mlsnoopy
Lieutenant
Lieutenant
Posts: 581
Joined: Sun Dec 16, 2007 4:42 pm
Location: Slovenija

Re: Saber class

Post by mlsnoopy »

Incorrect. The torps from the rollbar each have the same point of origin.
No they don't. :)
If it's intended for use in battles, then it should be designed for use in battles. The GCS is horribly designed when it comes to combat. The fact that it was Starfleet's most powerful ship until the Sovereign came along makes the situation even worse.


So by the definition of a BS, it's a battle ship. Until something bigger and better comes along.
Again, the fact that Starfleet uses it in one role does not mean that it wouldn't be better in another role, as this ship clearly would be.
Realy. So you are ignoring canon facts. My theory fits nicely with canon facts, so who is right.
Prove it. We see both dorsal and ventral torp launchers on the Akira firing at least 4 torps from a single launcher. That's not different in any way from the GCS.
No we haven't. One has such capabilitiy. But those in the rollbar don't sorry.
But you still have to confirm from a canon source. That it has 15 TT.
Mikey
Fleet Admiral
Fleet Admiral
Posts: 35635
Joined: Fri Jul 27, 2007 3:04 am
Commendations: The Daystrom Award
Location: down the shore, New Jersey, USA
Contact:

Re: Saber class

Post by Mikey »

mlsnoopy wrote:So by the definition of a BS, it's a battle ship.
No, not really. If you're forced to use a cruiser as a battleship, it is still by definition a cruiser.
mlsnoopy wrote:Realy. So you are ignoring canon facts. My theory fits nicely with canon facts, so who is right.
Canon can only show how it used; unless there was an episode describing the R&D of the Akira-class, canon cannot possibly show the intended role of the ship.
I can't stand nothing dull
I got the high gloss luster
I'll massacre your ass as fast
as Bull offed Custer
Blackstar the Chakat
Banned
Posts: 5594
Joined: Mon Jul 16, 2007 8:53 pm

Re: Saber class

Post by Blackstar the Chakat »

So by the definition of a BS, it's a battle ship. Until something bigger and better comes along.
Actually the abriviation for a battleship is BB. BS is the abriviation for bullshit. FYI
Sionnach Glic
4 Star Admiral
4 Star Admiral
Posts: 26014
Joined: Fri Jul 13, 2007 10:58 pm
Location: Poblacht na hÉireann, Baile Átha Cliath

Re: Saber class

Post by Sionnach Glic »

No they don't.
After watching the scene in question a further three times, I can assure you they do. They all come from the launcher that is second from the starboard side of the ship in the rollbar. If you wish to contend this issue, then provide pictures.
So by the definition of a BS, it's a battle ship. Until something bigger and better comes along.
Incorrect. The GCS is a cruiser, albeit a heavy one. The fact that it has heavier armament than other ships does not make it a battleship, for the same reason there are no modern battleships.
Realy. So you are ignoring canon facts. My theory fits nicely with canon facts, so who is right.
Quote where a Starfleet officer says "the Akira class is designed for close combat situations".
Until you can do that, canon has nothing to say about the role of the Akira class. The fact that Starfleet chooses to employ it in a certain role does not mean that it was designed with that role in mind. Plenty of ships throughout history have been put into roles they weren't designed to fill due to various unforseeable circumstance. The ship's armament clearly points to it being a torpedo boat, not a close combat vessel. Starfleet's incompetance does not refute this point.
No we haven't. One has such capabilitiy. But those in the rollbar don't sorry.
As I've just shown, all torp tubes observed have had the same fire rate. It is just common sense to assume the ones that weren't observed have a similar fire rate.
But you still have to confirm from a canon source. That it has 15 TT.
Graham's page on the ship in question provides the 15 torp tube number from Star Trek: The Magazine. It also lists the following locations:
"Pod: 7 total, 4 in upper section of pod, 3 in lower section, all face forward
Saucer: 7 total, 3 forward below the front shuttle bay doors, 4 in dorsal surface, 2 port, 2 starboard. The latter four face out to port and starboard, respectively - so far as I know these are the only torpedo tubes we've ever seen which don't fire parallel to the direction of motion. Finally there is 1 in the lower hull section, just below the deflector dish. "

In addition to this, the model I mentioned that we discussed in an earlier thread had the same amount.

Of course, none of those are exactly canon sources, so we have to look to the show itself. Graham's collection of pictures proves very helpful for this:
Image
Isn't MS Paint great?
Anyway, observe the dark depressions in the port and starboard hull marked 1 & 2 respectively. These are possibly recesses for the torp tubes mounted there.
Also, note number 3, where you can see 4 tubes. There's a better picture later.
Image
Ventral hull tubes. Number three is the likely location of the one mentioned to be just below the deflector dish.
Image
Rollbar tubes. 1 is a better shot of the four upper tubes. 2 is the location of the three lower tubes.
Also, please note the torp just leaving the upper tubes that has just exited from the tube that is second from the left. I tried tracing the other torp back to its point of origin, but the point turned out to be above the ship. Unsurprising given it would have moved. However, do note that it is in the location where the second-from-left tube would have previously been.
Image
Last one, and we get a better shot of the recess in the side of the ship. Either that's the shortest phaser bank in history, or a couple of torp tubes.
"You've all been selected for this mission because you each have a special skill. Professor Hawking, John Leslie, Phil Neville, the Wu-Tang Clan, Usher, the Sugar Puffs Monster and Daniel Day-Lewis! Welcome to Operation MindFuck!"
Blackstar the Chakat
Banned
Posts: 5594
Joined: Mon Jul 16, 2007 8:53 pm

Re: Saber class

Post by Blackstar the Chakat »

Excellent analysis Rochey. I gotta give you props on this one.
Post Reply